"Murder after Birth"

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.
gozer
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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby gozer » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:37 am


you must be joking
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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby you must be joking » Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:11 am

snoqueen wrote:1) When in an argument one party invokes a deity or the afterlife, you know he's run out of actual points to be made and has to rely on the threat of the supernatural;

2) Arguing about access to abortion is like arguing with a vegan.


Okay Sno, I get your point.

So let's make this a bit more real. How about we examine the idea that on the fact that we have gone from the idea of abortion being "safe, legal and rare". When abortion was done on a "unviable" clump of cells" that was not a child.

When a late term abortion was only to preserve the "life of the mother", to now living in a society that openly admits to wanting to have INFANTICIDE.

There are those in power in our society that want the ability to decide the definition of when a person is a person, as New York did in stating that a person is only a person after they have been born. Or Virginia tried to do in saying that a person is only a person after they are born and WANTED!

And considering the move toward some sort of national health care plan as is being proposed by the Democrats.

Well, just how long do you think, and what will be the next group of what are now considered PEOPLE to be considered as expendable because they cost too much?

The developmentally disabled?

Children born with birth defects?

How about the elderly who are for the most part, "bedridden" or those who have memory care issues?

Or how about the opinions of those who just piss off the people who are in power at the moment?

The sad thing is, we now live in a society that pays hitmen to murder unborn children. The people in our society are good with, or at the very least ambivalent to the murders of those children. So in my book, it won't be long before other "undesirables" meet the same fate.

If you want a dystopian world that is a cross between 1984 and the Hunger Games knock yourself out. As for me, I want no part of it.

Cadfael
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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby Cadfael » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:28 am

Actually most of the disadvantaged children you mention ARE allowed to suffer because they cannot pay. Some of them are helped by charity, but most definitely not all of them. Your government, which you wish to legislate against OTHER issues, does not mandate their health or care.

If you were really interested in the lives of all those people you talk about, you would have been talking about them, and advocating for governmental intervention, long before now. The only reason they matter now is because they appear to you to be good talking points.

At this very moment, when you could be advocating for them, you choose to advocate for a nonexistent issue, and you use their suffering like an object. You are not a Christian.

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby snoqueen » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:46 am

...If you were really interested in the lives of all those people you talk about, you would have been talking about them, and advocating for governmental intervention...


The big flashing hypocrisy sign lights up every time. What about health care for already-born children? What about affordable birth control? And health care for mothers, at all stages? What about funds for those who have a complicated and expensive pregnancy, birth, or special-needs babies? What about child care, so the moms can work and support their children? (Do the math -- that doesn't happen on the average working mom's paycheck.) What about family leave, so parents can stay home and take care of the littlest babies?

Nope. None of that. Just yelling about one point, devoid of any context.

Why does this remind me of the gun-deaths issue, where all they focus on is "right to bear arms" with no larger context of consequences and causes?

You can't solve social problems by simply repeating one slogan. You have to dig behind that point to the complex facts. Otherwise you're just showing laziness and an inability to think for yourself.

you must be joking
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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby you must be joking » Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:16 am

snoqueen wrote:
...If you were really interested in the lives of all those people you talk about, you would have been talking about them, and advocating for governmental intervention...


The big flashing hypocrisy sign lights up every time. What about health care for already-born children? What about affordable birth control? And health care for mothers, at all stages? What about funds for those who have a complicated and expensive pregnancy, birth, or special-needs babies? What about child care, so the moms can work and support their children? (Do the math -- that doesn't happen on the average working mom's paycheck.) What about family leave, so parents can stay home and take care of the littlest babies?

Nope. None of that. Just yelling about one point, devoid of any context.

Why does this remind me of the gun-deaths issue, where all they focus on is "right to bear arms" with no larger context of consequences and causes?

You can't solve social problems by simply repeating one slogan. You have to dig behind that point to the complex facts. Otherwise you're just showing laziness and an inability to think for yourself.



Sno,

I think that Star Parker says it better than I ever could as she has first hand experience with this issue as a black woman who has had four abortions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpkacXprBjo

I have to agree with her comments. You cannot improve any society without a respect for life. Once that respect for life is gone, you will have a society in decay.


And watch and listen to what the absolute turd the P.O.S., I mean "congressperson", Steve Cohen said.

I want to analyze some of what he said:

Steve Cohen said to a very well educated, articulate Star Parker in part: "Firstly we're in filler time, waiting for somebody to come testify"

That comment right there is an absolute dis on her and what she said.

He then goes on to say in part:

"To suggest I'm disingenuous shows your ignorance or your absolute inability to deal with Congresspeople they way they should."

Yeah, that's like him saying: "I'm the master up here and you little people, you Black People, especially you Black Women, better learn to address me with the respect I deserve as you work for me!"

And Steve Cohen thought he deserved an apology from her?

If a white Republican congressman had ever said that to a Black Woman, he would be absolutely destroyed by the main stream media as a bigot and a misogynist. Every talk show, every radio and t.v. commentator, every pundit far and wide would have gone after any Republican congressman who said even one tenth of what the Democrat Steve Cohen said to Star Parker in that exchange and yet we heard absolutely nothing in the main stream press when he made these remarks.

Why is that?

But then again, according to Open Secrets, as of 2015 Steve Cohen's net worth is around 5,000,000 dollars so I don't think that rich old white boy has any idea of what it means to be a poor Black Person. That is why his idea of solving the problems of the Black Community is to kill Black Babies.

Just wondering when we will see year book pictures of him in black face or in a KKK outfit!

I mean if the robe fits! Just saying.

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby Cadfael » Sun Feb 17, 2019 6:35 pm

you must be joking wrote: You cannot improve any society without a respect for life. Once that respect for life is gone, you will have a society in decay.

When we have no veterans dying homeless in the streets, when our homeless population in general are being treated like people instead of vermin, when all our children are getting proper medical care, lunches in school, and shelter from abusive parents, when our gun deaths have dropped below the gun deaths of other developed nations, when Native Americans aren't attacked by dogs for defending their land from oil pipelines, and when our elders without families are being cared for in their waning years, then maybe, MAYBE I'll believe you have respect for life.

Hell I'll even settle for you just advocating for any of that. Can't remember when it's mattered at all to you, though.
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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby HawkHead » Sun Feb 17, 2019 7:50 pm

9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby Bwis53 » Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:54 pm

The Republicans themselves are being disingenuous. If a woman in their family became pregnant and for various reasons didn't want to carry the pregnancy, they would quietly get an abortion. Or maybe if their mistress got pregnant. They're only using the abortion issue to get votes.

When I was younger, I thought I was against abortion. A woman in my work place had her baby and everybody else looked down on her because she was an unwed mother. Then my best friend got pregnant. I ran into her at a Planned Parenthood. I was being fitted for an IUD. Little did I know, my friend was on her way to NYC, for an abortion. Much later, I was the first one she told and swore to secrecy. I absolutely felt I could not judge her. I felt only mercy and understanding.

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby gargantua » Sun Feb 17, 2019 10:37 pm

Bwis53 wrote:The Republicans themselves are being disingenuous. If a woman in their family became pregnant and for various reasons didn't want to carry the pregnancy, they would quietly get an abortion. Or maybe if their mistress got pregnant. They're only using the abortion issue to get votes.

This is absolutely true. And the ymbj wing of the party is aware of it. I follow a couple of "conservatives" on Twitter, just to comment on the crazy. They go on and on about how the Republican establishment continually betrays them. Then I point out that a lunatic fringe should expect to be treated like that.
They don't like me very much.

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby you must be joking » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:58 am

Cadfael wrote:
you must be joking wrote: You cannot improve any society without a respect for life. Once that respect for life is gone, you will have a society in decay.

When we have no veterans dying homeless in the streets, when our homeless population in general are being treated like people instead of vermin, when all our children are getting proper medical care, lunches in school, and shelter from abusive parents, when our gun deaths have dropped below the gun deaths of other developed nations, when Native Americans aren't attacked by dogs for defending their land from oil pipelines, and when our elders without families are being cared for in their waning years, then maybe, MAYBE I'll believe you have respect for life.

Hell I'll even settle for you just advocating for any of that. Can't remember when it's mattered at all to you, though.
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Cadfael,

Okay, so maybe when we have a society that is free from every type of oppression; when we have rainbows and unicorns and gentle warm breezes; a society when all is fair and nothing is seen as unfair with peace and prosperity throughout the world.

And when will that ever happen?

Has it ever happened?

You want to hold me to a standard that you and I and the rest of the world have NEVER met.

So much for that argument!

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Re: "Murder after Birth"

Postby Cadfael » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:00 am

We can't save the children who are already born, so we have to save the ones who aren't born yet. So later, we can let them die. Because we have respect for life.

So much for that argument.


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