Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

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gozer
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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby gozer » Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:26 pm

is this patriot with the upper-case "p" as in the black helicopter/linda thompson/terry nichols crowd? the stickers on the back of road signs being to lead belgian troops to the city centres and nukes after the invasion goes down?

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby gargantua » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:53 pm

I don't think they're the same but I don't know for sure. This group seems to be strictly a second amendment absolutist sort of group.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:59 pm

I suspected this would come out eventually: The reason why the NRA, which spent $419 million in 2016, is suddenly broke...

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... sh-hawley/

Documents Show NRA and Republican Candidates Coordinated Ads in Key Senate Races
"You do this if you think no one is going to investigate," says a former federal regulator

... to avoid paying fines. They'll conveniently shift funding to a new organization instead, and declare bankruptcy.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:44 pm

You know that CDC report that anti-life gun advocates always cite now for "evidence" of
annual defensive uses of guns that vary from 55,000 to several million... The CDC study is actually a study of other studies to show that more research is needed in about 100 or more different areas. Just reviewing about 12 pages at the end of the report, I found...
https://www.nap.edu/read/18319/chapter/3#68

“There is limited research on the effectiveness of interventions and strategies to prevent firearm violence, and where there has been research, stakeholders often disagree about its implications. Two of the most challenging and important issues are the inadequacy of or lack of access to data (Weiner et al., 2007) and the use of study designs that have limited ability to establish causality. Data used in research on firearm violence are largely taken from datasets developed for other purposes.”

“Although communities, schools, and campuses have developed myriad safety plans, there is very little information available about their effectiveness.”

“Regarding interventions for public mass shootings, there is no conclusive information about which policies and enforcement and prevention strategies might be effective.”

“Controlling access to guns through background checks or restrictions on particular types of firearms remains controversial and requires additional research.”

“To date, there is little information about the potential role of mobile phone interventions or other electronic interventions in preventing firearm violence…”

“There is limited research on the effectiveness of interventions and strategies to prevent firearm violence…”

“There is a lack of data on the basis for these laws or on their effectiveness…”

“More data are needed to examine the potential impact of personalized guns in several areas of public health interest…”

“However, data on the prevalence of firearm violence in the media are absent.”

“Although there is not much research in this area… it would be useful to carry out more in-depth studies… in-depth studies might also produce insights that could… has not been the subject of systematic research.”

“The fact that these studies are non-experimental introduces uncertainties in interpreting… Further, no experimental or quasi-experimental research (only research based on observational longitudinal and survey studies) has been carried out to provide definitive evidence…”

“…the absence of experimental data renders it impossible to make unequivocal interpretations of these long-term associations …”

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:38 pm

Furthermore, the anti-life, gun advocates always compare these figures to gun homicides rather than offensive uses of guns. If you compare it to actual offensive uses of guns, it's another ballgame.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.brooki ... -data/amp/

"The geography, incidence, and underreporting of gun violence: New evidence using ShotSpotter data"
Criminal activity is often selectively underreported... new surveillance technologies are facilitating the collection of more accurate data on crime... we describe data on gunfire incidents, recorded using a tool called ShotSpotter.

We compare those data with previously-available data on gun violence (reported crime and 911 calls)
...
Using data from Washington, DC, and Oakland, CA, we find that only 12% of gunfire incidents result in a 911 call to report gunshots, and only 2-7% of incidents result in a reported assault with a dangerous weapon. These extremely low reporting rates have important implications for research on gun violence.


And that doesn't include the offensive uses of guns that aren't fired-likely far more than offensive uses when they are fired, or the delusional gun advocate's claim that his offensive use of a gun was in "self-defense," which is likely also a significant figure.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:27 pm

Another interesting read...
https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/407809/

The Slave-State Origins of Modern Gun Rights
The idea that citizens have an unfettered constitutional right to carry weapons in public originates in the antebellum South, and its culture of violence and honor.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:49 pm

https://trofire.com/2019/01/28/6-mass-s ... en-notice/
6 Mass Shootings in 4 Days, And Americans Didn’t Even Notice
By Farron Cousins - January 28, 2019

Between Wednesday and Saturday of last week, there were six mass shootings that left multiple people dead, per incident. This has become such a normal thing in this country that the media didn’t bother to devote any time to these atrocities and the public didn’t even realize that they happened.
...
How many of these did you hear about? How many of these stories did you see the corporate media pay any attention to? How many times did they bring on anyone to talk about this deadly epidemic happening in the United States happening every single day, more than once per day? You didn’t. They may have talked about that Florida shooting just because it was so gruesome and sadistic, but I guarantee you they didn’t talk about the other ones. You would waste your time going back trying to search for these because they don’t even exist and that’s what’s so disgusting about this. As we’ve become so numb to it, we have become so used to it that it’s not even coverage anymore. It’s not even news...

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby gozer » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:07 pm

shot spotter is the acoustic gunfire-locating system, by the way . . . how close is madison to having this, or do they already?

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:28 pm

gozer wrote:shot spotter is the acoustic gunfire-locating system, by the way . . . how close is madison to having this, or do they already?


We probably have to many other expensive issues like shitty roads and flood protection, etc., and not enough gunfire, to worry about it yet.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby gozer » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:36 pm

jonnygothispen wrote:
gozer wrote:shot spotter is the acoustic gunfire-locating system, by the way . . . how close is madison to having this, or do they already?


We probably have to many other expensive issues like shitty roads and flood protection, etc., and not enough gunfire, to worry about it yet.


that was exactly what i figured . . .

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:55 am

https://www.thetrace.org/2015/07/defens ... -use-myth/

Gunfight or Flight: New Study Finds No Advantages to Using a Firearm in Self-Defense Situations

... data from the National Crime Victimization Survey — an annual survey of 90,000 households — and shows not only that so-called “defensive gun use” (DGU) rarely protects a person from harm, but also that such incidents are much more rare than gun advocates claim.
...
... incidents where a victim used a gun in self-defense, the likelihood of suffering an injury was 10.9 percent. Had the victim taken no action at all, the risk of injury was virtually identical: 11 percent. Having a gun also didn’t reduce the likelihood of losing property:

“Guns are used to threaten and intimidate far more often than they are used in self-defense. Most self-reported self-defense gun uses may well be illegal and against the interests of society.”

“I was watching a movie and he interrupted me. I yelled at him that I was going to shoot him and he ran to his car.” Another respondent pulled out a gun to resolve a conflict with his neighbor: “I was on my porch and this man threw a beer in my face so I got my gun.”


Of course, of course. This was obvious to me just from the conversations I've had with gun dudes.

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Re: Wouldn't it be great if everybody had a gun?

Postby jonnygothispen » Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:38 am

That CDC report...
https://www.nap.edu/catalog/18319/prior ... d-violence

In January 2013, President Barack Obama issued 23 executive orders directing federal agencies to improve knowledge of the causes of firearm violence, what might help prevent it, and how to minimize its burden on public health. One of these orders directed the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) to, along with other federal agencies, immediately begin identifying the most pressing problems in firearm violence research. The CDC and the CDC Foundation asked the IOM, in collaboration with the National Research Council, to convene a committee tasked with developing a potential research agenda that focuses on the causes of, possible interventions to, and strategies to minimize the burden of firearm-related violence.
* Italics mine


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