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Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:19 am
by DCB
penquin wrote:
Weather Bob wrote:One of the boys is (gleefully!) doing that white-power version of the "OK" hand symbol


The student wasn't even doing it in the style of the alleged "white power" sign but rather he was doing it exactly like the game that has been played by kids for the past couple generations..


Even if you think its "just a game", W-B's point still stands: the student making the OK sign indicates that these fuckwads were deliberately invoking Nazi/white supremacy. It wasn't just a "wave".

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:40 am
by Cadfael
I cannot think of an instance where a non-racist made themselves appear racist to other people for enjoyment, because they thought it was fun to make people think they were racists when in fact they actually believed all people were equal. Even in high school.

The only ones who did that were already racist and they thought it was so normal that they couldn't quite figure out that a non-racist would not want to appear racist.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:47 am
by Bwis53
Whether it was ignorance on the photographer and students part, I think they should restudy history and apologize. I read or heard that they are going to have an event, where a rabbi will explain it to them.

It is troubling that they are now getting threats.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:48 am
by penquin
DCB wrote:Even if you think its "just a game", W-B's point still stands: the student making the OK sign indicates that these fuckwads were deliberately invoking Nazi/white supremacy. It wasn't just a "wave".


You are confusing two different symbols. (And perhaps two different games). This is what the so-called "White Power" sign looks like:

Image


The kid up front isn't making the hand gesture like that, but rather he is making the sign with the fingers tight and below the waist...in the same manner which the circle game is played:

Image

The more I hear about this story the more obvious it is what happened, and it surely ain't the photographer said "Everybody smile and say "Hitler!". Rather a pic was taken of kids waving to their parents, with one kid up front playing the circle game. Months after the picture was posted online some other kid(s) thought it looked like a seig heil and decided to re-tweet it with the now infamous caption. People got triggered and the mob now demands these kids be severely punished.

It'll be interesting to see what the investigation turns up.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:02 am
by DCB
penquin wrote:The more I hear about this story the more obvious it is what happened, and it surely ain't the photographer said "Everybody smile and say "Hitler!". Rather a pic was taken of kids waving to their parents, with one kid up front playing the circle game. Months after the picture was posted online some other kid(s) thought it looked like a seig heil and decided to re-tweet it with the now infamous caption. People got triggered and the mob now demands these kids be severely punished.

It'll be interesting to see what the investigation turns up.

Sure.

And those aren't Nazi swastikas. They're Zoroastrian symbols that represent love for all religions.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:36 am
by penquin
DCB wrote:And those aren't Nazi swastikas. They're Zoroastrian symbols that represent love for all religions.


While the symbol could mean both, I have to disagree with you on this one. Given the location and written messages, it seems to me that those are being used in the Nazi manner rather than the much older usage you mentioned.

I am curious tho - why do you automatically assume the worst about the kids in Baraboo while assuming the best intentions about the graffiti near the synagogue?

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:57 am
by massimo
I believe in the middle ground here-- the kids were not just fucking waving to their parents, but at the same time they are not, to a child, all evil racist scum bags. Gross stupidity happened, and they should be reprimanded and taught.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:40 pm
by pjbogart
On the one hand we have a group of young, impressionable kids who are likely rather ignorant of the history of Naziism and on the other hand we have a President who routinely attacks the free press, uses his party's machinery to spread propaganda, scapegoats minorities and questions the patriotism of anyone who disagrees with him.

There are dangerous people around us, but I don't think you'll find them in Prom photos. At least not yet.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:48 pm
by Beaver
Here is the Baraboo h.s. musical:


Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:51 pm
by Bwis53
Poor humor.

Hogan's Heroes would be more like it.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:52 pm
by gozer
the one with the fingers pointed down appears to be a sartorially-driven variant of the ku klux klan sign . . . i doubt it is a gang sign of sorts for the high school heavy-petting club . . .

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:35 pm
by gargantua
I don't know what they were thinking. The red light for me was the one kid saying "we even got the black kid to put it up". If it's true that someone actually said that, it's pretty damning. Why would anyone say that?

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 12:22 pm
by jonnygothispen
Having lived in small town Wisconsin, like many others here, and stopping back to visit friends, my opinion is that racism is so accepted that Nazi salutes and stuff like that aren't a big deal there. It's the way it is. Likewise with offensive racial jokes, cajoling because of race, etc. It's the way it is. What's to be done about it? Frank Zappa suggested reinstating the "Civics Class" he had that talks about the struggle for human rights, and was replaced with "social studies," the Dick and Jane view of American history. Where are you when we need you, Howard Zinn?

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:03 pm
by snoqueen
jonnygothispen wrote:Having lived in small town Wisconsin, like many others here, and stopping back to visit friends, my opinion is that racism is so accepted that Nazi salutes and stuff like that aren't a big deal there. It's the way it is. Likewise with offensive racial jokes, cajoling because of race, etc. It's the way it is.


Friend of mine finally got a good job in construction, one he earned by doing the basics and taking fundamentals at MATC. He likes the work overall but is appalled at the casual racism. He needs the job and plans to stick with it because the pay is decent and the work is satisfying, and as a newbie he's not in a position to challenge the older guys on the job site. This is right in Madison.

So I agree with what you say here and suggest it's not just small town Wisconsin, it's a lot of white Wisconsin in general. We just don't come in contact with it unless we deliberately put ourselves in certain situations, because people with those attitudes edit their words carefully around customers and untrusted strangers.

I'm saying some of those Baraboo kids hadn't learned to edit yet, or thought they were on home territory and could get away with it.

Re: What's up with Baraboo?

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 3:23 pm
by Beaver
Comedian Charlie Berens lampoons Baraboo students' apparent Nazi salute
https://www.channel3000.com/news/charli ... /871419614