Tony Evers for governor

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Zoti Bemba
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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Zoti Bemba » Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:42 pm

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but hasn't Scott Walker been running (and, sadly, winning) on a few Very Positively Stated (but poorly detailed, explained or planned out) "promises" and a whole lot of "Not that guy"/"Not that party" endlessly echoed down the endless interconnected dark money corridors? I mean, seriously, the guy's platform, vision and accomplishments are paper thin; he can't think on his feet, has no charisma, isn't particularly bright, rarely appears in public in any kind of situation that his handlers can't control (and basically freaks out when asked an off-topic question). What has this guy got except ridiculous, ginned-up negatives aimed at his opponents? Why shouldn't the Dems run, and expect to win, the same way? Or just figure they are permanently in the losers' column thanks to gerrymandering and voter suppression and right wing hate radio and conservative social and social media networks quietly training their participants to vote "R" in every election, no matter the issues or the facts or the candidates. Which all renders anything any Dems say moot anyway. Just sayin'.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Paleo2 » Tue Nov 28, 2017 8:22 am

All you say about Walker may be true, but the Dems can't beat him anyway.

A very quick question, to be answered in one sentence. "Not Walker" doesn't count as an answer.

What did the two Democrats who ran against Walker 3 times stand for?




I can't answer that one either.

Walker ran on "job creation" and making Wisconsin "open for business".

OK, he has been a miserable failure, and also quite a bit of bait-and-switch. Running on one thing then delivering something much worse. However, I could give you Walker's platform in one sentence,


Democrats need a nice, catchy, easy-to-remember platform.

How about: "Good schools, good roads, good jobs, good government" ?

That would (A) give a positive platform that is easy to remember and (B) point out the main failures of the Walker administration.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby timby » Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:17 pm

Zoti Bemba wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong here, but hasn't Scott Walker been running (and, sadly, winning) on a few Very Positively Stated (but poorly detailed, explained or planned out) "promises" and a whole lot of "Not that guy"/"Not that party" endlessly echoed down the endless interconnected dark money corridors? I mean, seriously, the guy's platform, vision and accomplishments are paper thin; he can't think on his feet, has no charisma, isn't particularly bright, rarely appears in public in any kind of situation that his handlers can't control (and basically freaks out when asked an off-topic question). What has this guy got except ridiculous, ginned-up negatives aimed at his opponents? Why shouldn't the Dems run, and expect to win, the same way? Or just figure they are permanently in the losers' column thanks to gerrymandering and voter suppression and right wing hate radio and conservative social and social media networks quietly training their participants to vote "R" in every election, no matter the issues or the facts or the candidates. Which all renders anything any Dems say moot anyway. Just sayin'.


A large part of the problem is that it's very, very difficult to overstate just how much damage Mike Tate did at the helm of DPW. He basically ran the party with the philosophy that he learned from Kathleen Falk: "If you aren't from Madison, you ain't shit and we aren't going to waste our time with you." And so for years voters were basically ignored and the party did nothing to mobilize them. And that played right into Republicans' hands, especially among moderate voters; if there's one thing guaranteed to get someone in, say, Marinette County all riled up and out to the polling place, it's telling them "those damn Madison liberals are saying they're better than you."

The sad thing is, as terrible as Tate was, the people under him, the regional coordinators, made him look like JFK. The party apparatus in 2014 was literally run by 22-year-old college graduates for whom it was their first full-time job (because no sane person would do that kind of work for less than $20,000 a year). Last time I stopped by the Milwaukee party office, I found a truly charming and wonderful array of dumpster-dived couches and every available surface covered in empty soda bottles.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Paleo2 » Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:44 pm

timby wrote:
Zoti Bemba wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong here, but hasn't Scott Walker been running (and, sadly, winning) on a few Very Positively Stated (but poorly detailed, explained or planned out) "promises" and a whole lot of "Not that guy"/"Not that party" endlessly echoed down the endless interconnected dark money corridors? I mean, seriously, the guy's platform, vision and accomplishments are paper thin; he can't think on his feet, has no charisma, isn't particularly bright, rarely appears in public in any kind of situation that his handlers can't control (and basically freaks out when asked an off-topic question). What has this guy got except ridiculous, ginned-up negatives aimed at his opponents? Why shouldn't the Dems run, and expect to win, the same way? Or just figure they are permanently in the losers' column thanks to gerrymandering and voter suppression and right wing hate radio and conservative social and social media networks quietly training their participants to vote "R" in every election, no matter the issues or the facts or the candidates. Which all renders anything any Dems say moot anyway. Just sayin'.


A large part of the problem is that it's very, very difficult to overstate just how much damage Mike Tate did at the helm of DPW. He basically ran the party with the philosophy that he learned from Kathleen Falk: "If you aren't from Madison, you ain't shit and we aren't going to waste our time with you." And so for years voters were basically ignored and the party did nothing to mobilize them. And that played right into Republicans' hands, especially among moderate voters; if there's one thing guaranteed to get someone in, say, Marinette County all riled up and out to the polling place, it's telling them "those damn Madison liberals are saying they're better than you."

The sad thing is, as terrible as Tate was, the people under him, the regional coordinators, made him look like JFK. The party apparatus in 2014 was literally run by 22-year-old college graduates for whom it was their first full-time job (because no sane person would do that kind of work for less than $20,000 a year). Last time I stopped by the Milwaukee party office, I found a truly charming and wonderful array of dumpster-dived couches and every available surface covered in empty soda bottles.


Meanwhile, the conservative movement spent quite a few decades building up grass-roots organizations, taking over the GOP, and building up the GOP organization.

Used to be Churches were fairly evenly divided between Dems and GOP. Not anymore. These days, the vast majority of white fundy churches are staunchly Republican. The conservative movement recruits from those churches for almost every elected office in the country. School board seat open in Hooterville? Get Church Lady from Hooterville to run, and get the rest of the congregation to give money and time for her campaign.

Unions used to be a big Democratic machine. So the GOP went whole hog on union busting. DO you really believe there was any other reason for Act 10 or the Right to Work laws? Republicans don't care how much the workers suffer, as long as they can bust the unions.

The various other civic and political organizations are dying off. As much as the Republicans on this board claim the KKK were all Democrats, the Klan was actually stronger in the North,and often staunchly Republican:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_Klan
ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Owen_Brewster

But, these political organizations, once divided between the Dems and the GOP are pretty much dying off now.


About all the Dems have left are the skeletons of the remaining unions, a few rabble rousers who call themselves community activists but can't bring out any voters, and the Unitarians.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Comrade » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:08 pm

Notice how the conversation wandered from new and original ideas Tony may or may not have for leading and the direction to take this state?

He doesn't have anything. Neither did Burke, (2X Barret), or even Doyle.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Henry Vilas » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:30 pm

Is that your endorsement for Walker?

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Comrade » Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:12 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Is that your endorsement for Walker?


NO! NOT AT ALL!

Believe it or not just because one side is wrong, that doesn't necessarily mean the other side is correct.

They could both be wrong and often are.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby gargantua » Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:26 pm

Personally, I find Mr. Evers to be almost as inspiring as Tom Barrett.

Next.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby gozer » Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:05 pm

i have been aligned with the milwaukee based and/or orientated factions of the state democratic party since i joined for precisely the reasons given above and was hoping that barrett as the nominee those two times would prevent a lot of what has happened and not since then . . . of course it was a couple of democrats who got on this kind of psycho-sexual trip putting non-violent political people in cages and sent gary george and others to the slammer for essentially participating in political activity (their own re-elections for the most part) and so on, which didn't help . . . no one can convince me that is not against at least the spirit of the first amendment . . .

The sad thing is, as terrible as Tate was, the people under him, the regional coordinators, made him look like JFK.


which is one thing which has changed -- in 2014 the situation was risible, about 15-20 years ago the madison-aligned factions (not all dane county people, to cite another example, joe wineke could be have been considered to be an independent or aligned with the milwaukee factions) were hell on wheels with dictator phelps and his buddies . . . praise be to mr soglin for opposing that prick . . .

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Comrade » Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:43 pm

gozer wrote:i have been aligned with the milwaukee based and/or orientated factions of the state democratic party since i joined for precisely the reasons given above and was hoping that barrett as the nominee those two times would prevent a lot of what has happened and not since then . . . of course it was a couple of democrats who got on this kind of psycho-sexual trip putting non-violent political people in cages and sent gary george and others to the slammer for essentially participating in political activity (their own re-elections for the most part) and so on, which didn't help . . . no one can convince me that is not against at least the spirit of the first amendment . . .

The sad thing is, as terrible as Tate was, the people under him, the regional coordinators, made him look like JFK.


which is one thing which has changed -- in 2014 the situation was risible, about 15-20 years ago the madison-aligned factions (not all dane county people, to cite another example, joe wineke could be have been considered to be an independent or aligned with the milwaukee factions) were hell on wheels with dictator phelps and his buddies . . . praise be to mr soglin for opposing that prick . . .


None of which has anything to do with presenting ideas to actually grow an economy or help people improve their lives.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Henry Vilas » Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:04 pm

Comrade wrote:None of which has anything to do with presenting ideas to actually grow an economy or help people improve their lives.

Kinda like the Congressional (Republican) tax plan.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Comrade » Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:10 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
Comrade wrote:None of which has anything to do with presenting ideas to actually grow an economy or help people improve their lives.

Kinda like the Congressional (Republican) tax plan.


WRONG!! Not true at all. That resembles what both Reagan and Kennedy did. It isn't partisan.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby HawkHead » Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:06 pm

Comrade wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote:
Comrade wrote:None of which has anything to do with presenting ideas to actually grow an economy or help people improve their lives.

Kinda like the Congressional (Republican) tax plan.


WRONG!! Not true at all. That resembles what both Reagan and Kennedy did. It isn't partisan.

You do understand we had a 70% tax rate on taxable income over 210,000+ when Reagan was President and higher when Kennedy was President?

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby jonnygothispen » Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:13 pm

Kennedy dropped the tax rate on the top from 91% to 70%, but he eliminated so many loopholes for the top that revenue was about the same.

Reagan gradually dropped the top rate from 70% to 28%, then raised taxes that mostly affected the low and middle classes 13Xs to make up for it.

But the turnips never had enough blood to begin with, so the national debt increased from $995 billion after Carter's last fiscal year to $4.4 trillion after GHW Bush's last budget.

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Re: Tony Evers for governor

Postby Comrade » Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:07 pm

And nearly 20 trillion after Obama


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