Today in voter suppression

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bleurose
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby bleurose » Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:01 am

I'm still waiting for the explanation of how it's NOT voter suppression to refuse to send anyone to senior centers and nursing homes to get photo IDs for those individuals who can't get to a DMV office. These are legitimate citizens who have the right to vote and in many/most cases have exercised their right to vote for decades and this completely unnecessary law specifically disenfranchises them - it has made it impossible for them to have the now-required photo ID. It is no longer enough for poll workers who know full well who these people are to vouch for them. I'm guessing that nursing home & senior center-based polling places will no longer be allowed either. That would be just so that in case some of our frail elderly did manage against all odds to get the damn photo ID, they can't get to a now-distant polling place to cast their vote.

Yup, preventing tons of voter fraud here :roll:

snoqueen
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby snoqueen » Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:53 am

I want to know who exactly has standing to bring a federal suit against this law and when they're going to bring it. You'd think the Voting Rights Act applied, and you'd think the systematic disenfranchisement of Hispanic and African American voters in Milwaukee would be sufficient. You'd also think the poll tax aspect, even if disguised, would be actionable.

I think the League of Women Voters wants to sue -- who else is out there? Is there some issue of timing involved, where if a suit is brought just before an election the law might be enjoined in time to free voters to participate normally in that election?

What's going on here? Is there a multi-state suit planned, since more states than just Wisconsin are trying this shit?

DCB
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby DCB » Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:14 am

snoqueen wrote: You'd also think the poll tax aspect, even if disguised, would be actionable.

I think the League of Women Voters wants to sue -- who else is out there?


LWV is on it:
http://www.lwvwi.org/Donate/WaystoSuppo ... wsuit.aspx

According to a news item I heard, they are indeed looking at the poll tax aspect.

I'm sure all the TeaPartiers will be up in arms (so to speak) about this violation of the 24th Amendment.

Henry Vilas
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:16 pm

(Some) college IDs will be acceptable for voting. But not Madison College.

ilikebeans
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby ilikebeans » Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:28 pm

The Legislature specifically disallowed IDs from technical colleges to be used.

Wow, had no idea about that one. Any idea what their stated justification was?

snoqueen
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby snoqueen » Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:05 pm

Whatever it is, it doesn't make any sense because the credits you earn at MATC are valid at UW, so why wouldn't your identity be equally valid?

No, I'm not calling it Madison College, either. It sounds like it's the University of Phoenix.

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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:15 pm

Adding to that, MATC offers associate degrees. Maybe it's valid for only those holding student IDs and also enrolled those programs.

The board also made clear that only IDs from public or private colleges or universities that award an associate degree or higher.

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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:14 pm

From today's Washington Post:
Republicans rewriting state election laws in ways that could hurt Democrats

Civil rights groups and others who represent Democratic-leaning constituencies say there have been few cases of voter fraud, given the millions of ballots cast and compared with the high number of poor and minority voters who will be affected.

Twenty-five percent of African American voters do not have a valid government-issued photo ID, compared with 8 percent of whites, according to a study by the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University Law School. The report also found that 15 percent of voters earning less than $35,000 per year do not have such an ID.

Bludgeon
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Bludgeon » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:35 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:From today's Washington Post:
Republicans rewriting state election laws in ways that could hurt Democrats

Civil rights groups and others who represent Democratic-leaning constituencies say there have been few cases of voter fraud, given the millions of ballots cast and compared with the high number of poor and minority voters who will be affected.

Twenty-five percent of African American voters do not have a valid government-issued photo ID, compared with 8 percent of whites, according to a study by the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University Law School. The report also found that 15 percent of voters earning less than $35,000 per year do not have such an ID.


This vagary borders on buggery. A bunch of political activist lawyers in New York City claim 25% of voting age black voters don't have a state issued ID? I can count on one hand all the people I know without an ID: zero. Expired ID's count for voting, even if they don't count for Brennan. How do you get a job without an ID? How do you get an apartment without an ID? You live here, you have an ID. You want food stamps you have an ID; you want rent assistance you have an ID. You want beer? You have an ID. You want to vote, you get an ID - which you can have - because you live here. The Chicago bus fraud brigade is not going to help in this election.

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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby wack wack » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:42 pm

Bludgeon wrote:This vagary borders on buggery. A bunch of political activist lawyers in New York City claim 25% of voting age black voters don't have a state issued ID? I can count on one hand all the people I know without an ID: zero.


My guess is you don't know very many black people, and don't know any that you could honestly call "friend."

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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby jman111 » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:45 pm

Bludgeon wrote: Expired ID's count for voting, even if they don't count for Brennan.
Well, not exactly. According to the WI GAB, DOT-issued DLs, DOT-issued IDs, military IDs and passports "must be unexpired, or if expired, have expired after the date of the most recent general election."

Bland
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Bland » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:48 pm

Bludgeon wrote:How do you get a job without an ID?

Is being employed required to vote?
Bludgeon wrote: How do you get an apartment without an ID?
Do you have to rent an apartment in order to vote?
Bludgeon wrote: You want food stamps you have an ID

Is getting food stamps a requirement for voting?
Bludgeon wrote:you want rent assistance you have an ID.

Is receiving rent assistance a requirement for voting?
Bludgeon wrote: You want beer? You have an ID.

Do you have to buy beer (or even be able to) before you can vote?
Bludgeon wrote: You want to vote, you get an ID

Only if laws are passed requiring it. This certainly didn't used to be the case!
Bludgeon wrote:You live here, you have an ID.

See the point is kinda that this simply isn't true for a small but significant portion of the population.

acereraser
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby acereraser » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:50 pm

Bludgeon wrote:This vagary borders on buggery. A bunch of political activist lawyers in New York City claim 25% of voting age black voters don't have a state issued ID? I can count on one hand all the people I know without an ID: zero.


I am guessing your sample size is a too small to make any inferences of which we can be confident.

However, it seems you are doubtful of the ability of a NYC study to accurately describe the types of voter fraud we may have here in Wisconsin, as well as the effects various methods of combating voter fraud would be likely to have on democracy in Wisconsin. We should look into these issues more closely and specifically, rather than using PAC sponsored legislation from other places that doesn't fit here, don't you agree?

Bludgeon
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Bludgeon » Fri Sep 16, 2011 1:52 pm

wack wack wrote:
Bludgeon wrote:This vagary borders on buggery. A bunch of political activist lawyers in New York City claim 25% of voting age black voters don't have a state issued ID? I can count on one hand all the people I know without an ID: zero.


My guess is you don't know very many black people, and don't know any that you could honestly call "friend."


Fuck you I live on the south side, "snark snark".

Bludgeon
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Re: Today in voter suppression

Postby Bludgeon » Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:04 pm

acereraser wrote:
Bludgeon wrote:This vagary borders on buggery. A bunch of political activist lawyers in New York City claim 25% of voting age black voters don't have a state issued ID? I can count on one hand all the people I know without an ID: zero.


I am guessing your sample size is a too small to make any inferences of which we can be confident.

However, it seems you are doubtful of the ability of a NYC study to accurately describe the types of voter fraud we may have here in Wisconsin, as well as the effects various methods of combating voter fraud would be likely to have on democracy in Wisconsin. We should look into these issues more closely and specifically, rather than using PAC sponsored legislation from other places that doesn't fit here, don't you agree?


I would like to agree because you put things so nicely, unfortunately I don't. In a close election there is the motivation for fraud; where there is motivation there will be fraudulent voters--unless you have a law that says you have to have an ID to vote.

2009, ACORN goes down; 2010, Republicans win the state by slim margins; 2011, voter ID law; same year, Democrats fail to win a senate majority. 2012, everybody who votes is a real person with one single identity, voting in their right district--Obama loses. No buses from Chicago on election day, no people running from district to district with forged electric bills to try and ratchet up the Madison/Milwaukee share of the vote, i.e. Democracy: majority rules.


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