Benghazi

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.
pjbogart
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Re: Benghazi

Postby pjbogart » Mon May 06, 2013 12:39 pm

Ned's just having difficulties processing the notion that we collect "facts" before we "blow shit up".

If military commanders advised that we "stand down", which is apparently what we did, were they negligent in not first contacting General N. Flanders? Or is the suggestion that the military commanders wanted to conduct a rescue and Obama intervened?

Ned Flanders
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Ned Flanders » Mon May 06, 2013 12:48 pm

pjbogart wrote:Ned's just having difficulties processing the notion that we collect "facts" before we "blow shit up".?

I think the peace lovers took care of that on their own.
pjbogart wrote:If military commanders advised that we "stand down", which is apparently what we did, were they negligent in not first contacting General N. Flanders? Or is the suggestion that the military commanders wanted to conduct a rescue and Obama intervened?

We need to dig through the mountain of lies that Obama, Hillary, Rice etc. have been doling out to their media partners for the past eight months.

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Re: Benghazi

Postby O.J. » Mon May 06, 2013 1:59 pm


snoqueen
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Re: Benghazi

Postby snoqueen » Mon May 06, 2013 3:50 pm

Come on, Troll Team. You can't let ol' Ned twist in the wind all by himself.

Ned Flanders
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Ned Flanders » Mon May 06, 2013 4:14 pm

It appears that you're doing the trolling, hon.

Detritus
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Detritus » Mon May 06, 2013 5:39 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:It appears that you're doing the trolling, hon.

Ned the feminist strikes again.

Sandi
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Sandi » Mon May 06, 2013 6:37 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:It appears that you're doing the trolling, hon.


Exactly.

What is is about is simply, the administration’s sham that al-Qaeda was on the run, Mubarak had to go, and the Arab Spring is a good thing. It was proven false when four good Americans were killed by terrorists, because the State department refused requests for increased security.

You can blame the Republicans all you want, but security at one particular consulate doesn't require special funding from congress.

The progressives here know that, so they have no counter arguments. They know any argument they make is support of the administration will be proven wrong. They know that they would be calling Hicks, a 22 year diplomat a liar and again be proven wrong. So he only thing they can do is troll, which makes them look worse than if they said nothing at all.

Henry Vilas
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon May 06, 2013 6:54 pm

Sandi wrote:They know that they would be calling Hicks, a 22 year diplomat a liar and again be proven wrong.

What was your position on Valerie Plame, who was outed as a convert CIA operative because of the Bush/Cheney lies about a false WMD nuclear threat from Iraq? In your mind, are the lives lost in the unnecessary invasion of Iraq trumped by the Benghazi tragedy?

Or are you just trying to score political points? Is it the fear of a President H. Clinton?

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Re: Benghazi

Postby Leroy Gates » Mon May 06, 2013 7:30 pm

Henry Vilas wrote: Is it the fear of a President H. Clinton?


Yes.

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Re: Benghazi

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon May 06, 2013 7:34 pm

Leroy Gates wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote: Is it the fear of a President H. Clinton?


Yes.

So make sure the GOP runs a credible candidate. Good luck with that.

Sandi
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Sandi » Mon May 06, 2013 8:49 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:What was your position on Valerie Plame, who was outed as a convert CIA operative because of the Bush/Cheney lies about a false WMD nuclear threat from Iraq?


My position was that Plame was guilty. Cheney was not.

Curious though: just what has Valerie Plame, or Bush/Cheney have to do with Benghazi? Ah just more deflection from the subject you don't wish to discuss!

Henry Vilas wrote:Or are you just trying to score political points? Is it the fear of a President H. Clinton?


Fear of President H. Clinton? lmao... After Benghazi she will have zero chance. I will bet you ten cookies to a doughnut that she will not run.

acereraser
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Re: Benghazi

Postby acereraser » Mon May 06, 2013 9:55 pm

Sandi wrote:My position was that Plame was guilty. Cheney was not.

Curious though: just what has Valerie Plame, or Bush/Cheney have to do with Benghazi? Ah just more deflection from the subject you don't wish to discuss!


Speaking for myself only, to offer you another perspective, it is not that I do not want to discuss Benghazi because I am loathe to bring left-leaning politicians under scrutiny. It is because those on the right were so willing to turn a blind eye to right-leaning politicians in the recent past, that I have a kind of reverse Boy Who Cried Wolf feeling for Benghazi. The continued striving to make Benghazi a scandal is so obviously politically calculated, overwhelmingly so when considering the inaction of conservatives, it really makes me uneasy to engage the matter fully.

You, for example, still find Plame at fault, and Cheney innocent, even after enough time has passed to consider the matter in hindsight. So, your analysis (and those of other conservatives) of that matter (and many other similar situations) has led me to believe your judgment to be impaired by political desires. In consideration of that, why would I think any differently about Benghazi? Heck, Leroy Gates admitted as much.

Fear of President H. Clinton? lmao... After Benghazi she will have zero chance. I will bet you ten cookies to a doughnut that she will not run.


I don't want to wager on this, but getting back to what I said above, odds are you are wrong.

Sandi
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Re: Benghazi

Postby Sandi » Mon May 06, 2013 10:11 pm

Ok I know where you stand acereraser.

In other words: you want to discuss the poster and/or political opponents, not the subject. Expected as much.

pjbogart
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Re: Benghazi

Postby pjbogart » Mon May 06, 2013 11:10 pm

Sorry, Sandi, the problem is that there isn't really anything to discuss. Republicans are conducting an ill-advised witch hunt to attempt to discredit Hillary Clinton by showing that four people died in a terrorist attack in Libya. My sincerest condolences to the families of the victims, but a US government employee working in Libya must understand the risks he takes. And believe it or not, military brass may indeed have given the orders to "stand down" as in, we can't save these guys, we don't know the strength of the attacking units and we aren't going to send a squad of army specialists on a suicide mission only to find out that the people they were supposed to rescue are long dead.

Such decisions are made by people who have experience in military matters. Who are you to question their decisions? How many medals are hanging from your lapel? People who are forced to make life and death decisions always risk making mistakes. This goes for firefighters, policemen, doctors and military commanders. But they make their decisions based upon the best information they have available. Oh, but wait! Some retired keyboard commando in Janesville decides she's going to provide her expert opinion on why they were wrong! Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. Those people have to live with shit like this while you play politics with people's funerals.

And why, as ace points out, are you standing on your head in fury over four dead Americans but seem completely ambivalent about the thousands of Americans who died in Iraq? It's not a case of trying to change the subject. I think people just discredit your "concern" because it seems so politically motivated.

And furthermore, even if you had anything remotely approaching proof that the military commanders, Secretary of State or President made a poor decision, it still doesn't amount to a hill of fucking beans. You're going to crucify Sergeant John Q. Smith every time he's forced to make a snap judgement and things go poorly? Some guy is forced to make an educated guess about whether the embassy staff in Benghazi can be saved or whether he's sending a squad of soldiers on a suicide mission and he has to make that decision right now.

It must be nice to be so all-knowing. Are you related to God?

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Re: Benghazi

Postby Leroy Gates » Tue May 07, 2013 3:56 am

"Hello, Washington Press Corps. What is the thirty year rule that has defined every White House scandal since Watergate? It is not the crime, it’s the cover-up that gets you in trouble."
http://thinkprogress.org/media/2005/07/11/1272/not-the-crime/?mobile=nc


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