What Policies?

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.
fisticuffs
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Re: What Policies?

Postby fisticuffs » Fri Jul 20, 2012 9:51 am

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exch ... 00284.html


That article seems to be calling for tougher regulations and tougher regulators, hardly the position Mitt Romney is taking. Not sure this makes the point you think it does. Is Dodd-Frank perfect? No. I'd like it much much stronger but it's a step in the right direction. it doesn't take a blind partisan to see Republicans have zero interest in fixing this system.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby snoqueen » Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:13 am

In that article, Sheila Bair is calling for MORE regulation and above all better-written regulation, not less (which I take to be some people's preference).

Whatever the regulations are, the banking community seems bent on finding ways to evade them. To them it's all part of the game. That's the reason bigger personal penalties (not just corporate penalties), more predictable strong enforcement, and adequately funded enforcement agencies are also needed.

There is nothing legislation can do to change the culture of the banks -- that's about like wishing Prohibition could change the culture of a country. All we can do is a better job of legislation and enforcement.

And the R's aren't even trying, because it is contrary to the wishes of their funding sources and their belief system, which is either that this all doesn't matter, or it'll right itself.

Which it shows no sign of doing.

So we're back to the beginning: the belief that Dodd-Frank isn't attaining its goals with regard to regulation of large financial institutions. That doesn't mean it should be somehow stricken from the books. It's a huge piece of legislation, far larger than the ACA, and others of its provisions are of considerable value including some protections for individual consumers against bank abuses.

I look forward to reading more from the Systemic Risk Council, for which Bair is speaking.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby acereraser » Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:46 pm

Comrade wrote:http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exchange/sheila-bair-two-years-dodd-frank-why-isn-122800284.html

Yet another article to document how Dodd Frank has been a failure. I could litterally post articles all day long on all four of the failures of Obama regarding economics that I outlined. There are reams and reams of this stuff out there from all kinds of sources.

You don't have to take my word for it. I rather enjoy the idea of the blind partisans remaining in denial. That will work out for them just like the recall did.



So, who are the blind partisans in denial? I have to echo what others have said, and take it a little further. (I don't know how you describe your political leanings, for the sake of time, I will describe you as a conservative, please correct me for accuracy.) You are the first conservative I can recall who has made an indication on TDPF that you would like the federal government to take Wall Street to task for corrupting our economy and government. I have never understood why Wall Street got a pass from the Tea Party folks, except that Dick Armey/AFP/Koch Brothers wanted it that way.

Who do you think is responsible for Dodd-Frank being a toothless (my word) failure (your word)?

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Stella_Guru » Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:22 pm

snoqueen wrote:There is nothing legislation can do to change the culture of the banks -- that's about like wishing Prohibition could change the culture of a country. All we can do is a better job of legislation and enforcement.

And the R's aren't even trying, because it is contrary to the wishes of their funding sources and their belief system, which is either that this all doesn't matter, or it'll right itself.

Which it shows no sign of doing.


President Obama has spent his entire presidency protecting Wall St. ( the guys who gave him campaign cash to become a viable candidate) starting with his rescue of Bush's bank bailout after it's initial defeat in Congress, in the last days of his candidacy nonetheless. He has packed his administration with bankers, passed his own bailout and in collaboration with the Federal Reserve, channeled at least $16 trillion into the accounts of both U.S. and European banks, by far the greatest transfer of capital in history. Then he followed with financial "reform" that left derivatives untouched. Now his Justice Department is in theater mode pretending to threaten the bankster class with criminal penelties for their manipulation of the global economy's benchmark interest rates, and talking tough about the LIBOR conspirators while giving immunity to Britain's Barclay's Bank and UBS. Oh yeah, and we are still waiting for his promise that a "special unit of prosecutors" will expand the investigation into abusive mortgage practices.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Comrade » Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:25 pm

Ok here is another one. This time it is from Mort Zuckerman who is a Democrat. He notices a drop off in new hiring after the passage of Obamacare.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/mzuckerma ... led?page=3

I could go on like this for a year.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby fisticuffs » Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:34 pm

I could go on like this for a year.


Especially if continue to not bother reading them. This article does not in any way shape or form mention "Obamacare".

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Comrade » Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:44 pm

acereraser wrote:
Comrade wrote:http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/the-exchange/sheila-bair-two-years-dodd-frank-why-isn-122800284.html

Yet another article to document how Dodd Frank has been a failure. I could litterally post articles all day long on all four of the failures of Obama regarding economics that I outlined. There are reams and reams of this stuff out there from all kinds of sources.

You don't have to take my word for it. I rather enjoy the idea of the blind partisans remaining in denial. That will work out for them just like the recall did.



So, who are the blind partisans in denial? I have to echo what others have said, and take it a little further. (I don't know how you describe your political leanings, for the sake of time, I will describe you as a conservative, please correct me for accuracy.) You are the first conservative I can recall who has made an indication on TDPF that you would like the federal government to take Wall Street to task for corrupting our economy and government. I have never understood why Wall Street got a pass from the Tea Party folks, except that Dick Armey/AFP/Koch Brothers wanted it that way.

Who do you think is responsible for Dodd-Frank being a toothless (my word) failure (your word)?


I don't subsribe to any party line. Yes, I think Wall Street should be held responsible for what it has done. BOTH parties let them get away with what has happened---not just the right. You might want to examine the role of Goldman Sachs in contributing to Obama and what they received in return from him if you don't believe me. I won't waste time on that here.

Other than that I am simply answering questions here. The question was which policies of Obama have failed. I answered with my own words which were not accepted as I knew they would not be. Instead of arguing, I am now quoting from many sources that will support my view when I am finnished. Honestly, haven't but glanced at the responses as they just try to sidetrack the issue, and I don't really care how some here respond. This is not a forum of objective intellectuals and I am well aware of it. What it is, (at least for me,) is entertainment.

Therefore your question of why I think Dodd Frank is not effective is not important. What is relevant is that it IS "toothless" if you want to use that word.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Comrade » Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:44 pm

fisticuffs wrote:
I could go on like this for a year.


Especially if continue to not bother reading them. This article does not in any way shape or form mention "Obamacare".


YES IT DOES. You missed it. Go back and try again. Look hard at the second to last paragraph on page 2, but the earlier parts of the same page deal with it as well.

Your reading comprehension really sucks Fisti! That might explain why you continuously arrive at erroneous conclusions without having done the proper homework or research and are so easily manipulated by party line thinking.
Last edited by Comrade on Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

fisticuffs
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Re: What Policies?

Postby fisticuffs » Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:57 pm

YES IT DOES. You missed it. Go back and try again.


Please quote it. Can't find anything.

fisticuffs
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Re: What Policies?

Postby fisticuffs » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:01 pm

Republicans filibuster measure to give tax breaks to companies bringing jobs back to US, eliminate tax breaks for outsourcing..
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/19/politics/ ... index.html

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:10 pm

fisticuffs wrote:
YES IT DOES. You missed it. Go back and try again.


Please quote it. Can't find anything.


Bullshit. I read it twice and even tried to find any of the terms with a search. Nothin'. The only thing I can think is that you INFER he is referencing health care because of his timeline. If that's the case, it's weak. If you can find me the quote in the article where he talks about the drop-off in hiring directly related to the ACA I'll put my tail between my legs and say I was wrong.

Comrade wrote: This is not a forum of objective intellectuals


And you somehow think you are?

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:15 pm

Comrade wrote:
fisticuffs wrote:
I could go on like this for a year.


Especially if continue to not bother reading them. This article does not in any way shape or form mention "Obamacare".


YES IT DOES. You missed it. Go back and try again. Look hard at the second to last paragraph on page 2, but the earlier parts of the same page deal with it as well.

Your reading comprehension really sucks Fisti! That might explain why you continuously arrive at erroneous conclusions without having done the proper homework or research and are so easily manipulated by party line thinking.


First off Mort Zuckerman switches parties all the time, so calling him a democrat is a bit disingenuous. On the other hand you are correct in that he does mention health care reform, or rather he refers to a report that blames health care reform:
According to the Heritage Foundation, private sector hiring through June 2011 was 10 times slower following the passage of President Obama's healthcare bill compared to the prior 16 months.


Of course you seem to have neglected to mention the second part of that statement:
Economists at Stanford University and the University of Chicago estimated in the fall of 2011 that policy uncertainty has cost more than 2 million jobs since early 2010. These estimates reflect the small business community's reluctance to make new hires until employers know exactly what the law means in practice.


Specifically that the uncertainty wasn't caused by the new law so much as not knowing if, when or how the law was going to be implemented.

So basically you are quoting an on again, off again democrat, who is using the Heritage foundation to back up his argument, in an opinion piece, and you neglected to notice that he says the job loss was less to do with the law, and more to do with waiting for the law to be implemented.

edit: and as a tip, maybe linking the third page of a three page article was pretty stupid too. If you aren't going to link the first page maybe at least link the page that has the reference you were talking about (page 2).
Last edited by Francis Di Domizio on Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:20 pm

Comrade wrote: This time it is from Mort Zuckerman who is a Democrat. He notices a drop off in new hiring after the passage of Obamacare.


You were correct, it was mentioned in the article. But, as was already stated, HE didn't notice the drop off, the Heritage foundation did.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby jonnygothispen » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:23 pm

Economic Downturn and Bush Policies Continue to Drive Large Projected Deficits http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3490
The events and policies that pushed deficits to these high levels in the near term were, for the most part, not of President Obama’s making. If not for the Bush tax cuts, the deficit-financed wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the effects of the worst recession since the Great Depression (including the cost of policymakers’ actions to combat it), we would not be facing these huge deficits in the near term. By themselves, in fact, the Bush tax cuts and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan will account for almost half of the $20 trillion in debt that, under current policies, the nation will owe by 2019. The stimulus law and financial rescues will account for less than 10 percent of the debt at that time.

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Re: What Policies?

Postby DCB » Fri Jul 20, 2012 5:49 pm

Comrade wrote:Ok here is another one. This time it is from Mort Zuckerman who is a Democrat. He notices a drop off in new hiring after the passage of Obamacare.
.. and before most of the provisions have been enacted.


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