Trickle-down Obama

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.
snoqueen
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:41 pm

I wanted to point out that while the Meades of the world love to yell about that "fifty eight percent!" statistic, they are not nearly as vocal about the total yearly income of the ultra rich, nor is it at all easy to find since they so love to bury their real incomes inside of legal constructs that have become so complicated it's impossible to trace the money movement.


In other words, Meade doesn't want to discuss the ways people like Mitt Romney can game the tax system (though he won't let us see how he did it) and wind up paying a relatively low tax rate, but his father George Romney not only paid his taxes (as shown by the dozen years' worth of tax forms he released to the public) but actually did not take advantage of a number of loopholes because he believed it was his civic responsibility as a wealthy person to generously support his country's government.

That's off limits. We can only talk about that certain itty-bitty, carefully-defined subset of an individual's overall economic activity, assets, and life that shows up on their 1040 as "adjusted gross income." Nothing else.
Last edited by snoqueen on Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Meade
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:43 pm

The CBO report said more recent data suggest overall income "continued to grow slowly in 2010 and 2011" and that higher earners saw their income increase more rapidly than others. Average federal tax rates "probably remained near their post-1979 low levels."

The data also underscore the extent to which higher-income earners already shoulder a large part of the federal tax load.

The top quintile of earners, who had average incomes of $223,500, paid 67.9% of all federal taxes owed, compared with 9.4% for the middle quintile and 0.3% for the lowest quintile, according to the CBO.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 99674.html

Meade
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:53 pm

snoqueen wrote:That's off limits. We can only talk about that certain itty-bitty, carefully-defined subset of an individual's overall economic activity, assets, and life that shows up on their 1040 as "adjusted gross income." Nothing else.

I never said that, Snoqueen. Why do you misrepresent what I said?

Talk about anything you want. I just suggested that if you want to talk about other topics, why not start a new topic?

snoqueen
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:56 pm

The top quintile of earners, who had average incomes of $223,500, paid 67.9% of all federal taxes owed, compared with 9.4% for the middle quintile and 0.3% for the lowest quintile, according to the CBO.


Obviously this is unfair. The lowest quintile ought to be paying 67.9% of all federal taxes owed, and the top quintile .3%. There are a lot more people in the lowest quintile than the top one, and right now the lowest are a bunch of freeloaders.

Because there are very few people in the top quintile, they should obviously be paying the least. In a perfectly fair system, every person would pay exactly the same amount of taxes as every other person.

And that includes zygotes, embryos, fetuses, and corporations.

Now let us move on.
Last edited by snoqueen on Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:57 pm

Why do I misrepresent what you say? Because it pleases me to do so. Like it or lump it.

Starting a topic is like being in love. If you love something, you have to set it free.
Last edited by snoqueen on Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Meade
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 9:58 pm

snoqueen wrote: "Mitt Romney can game the tax system (though he won't let us see how he did it) and wind up paying a relatively low tax rate

If he won't let us see how he did it, how can you be so sure he "gamed the tax system"? What was his tax rate? Do you know? Or are you just assuming it is "relatively" low?

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:04 pm

13.9%.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-01-2 ... ncome.html

(That's not only a reference, it's a pretty good article.)
Last edited by snoqueen on Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Meade
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:07 pm

snoqueen wrote:13.9%

What is that? The percentage of their income the Romneys gave to charity?

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby snoqueen » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:09 pm

Click the link, you oaf. I'm not explaining everything to you.

Over and out.

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby DCB » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:12 pm

Meade wrote:If he won't let us see how he did it, how can you be so sure he "gamed the tax system"?

Because his buddy Lindsay Graham says so:
Mitt Romney shouldn't be criticized for using off-shore tax havens because "it's really American to avoid paying taxes, legally,"
...
"It's a game we play," Graham said. "Every American tries to find the way to get the most deductions they can. I see nothing wrong with playing the game because we set it up to be a game."

Meade
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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:18 pm

That isn't "gaming the system". Gaming the system requires some amount of operating in bad faith. An example of gaming the system would be when Snoqueen intentionally misrepresents what someone else has said in order to please herself. She plays by her own rules. Like it or lump it.

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby Meade » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:22 pm

The president and his wife, Michelle Obama, reported adjusted gross income of $789,674 in 2011, and paid just over 20 percent of it in federal taxes, according to income tax returns and gift-tax returns released by the White House on Friday.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/14/us/po ... turns.html

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby rabble » Thu Jul 12, 2012 6:41 am

Meade wrote:Talk about anything you want. I just suggested that if you want to talk about other topics, why not start a new topic?

I suggest you kiss my ass.
;-)

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby rabble » Thu Jul 12, 2012 6:42 am

Meade wrote:That isn't "gaming the system". Gaming the system requires some amount of operating in bad faith. An example of gaming the system would be when Snoqueen intentionally misrepresents what someone else has said in order to please herself. She plays by her own rules. Like it or lump it.

And you don't. You're the moderate. Yeah. We heard that.

Okay. 72 percent of the wealth, 58 percent of the tax. Let's keep talking about that.

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Re: Trickle-down Obama

Postby wack wack » Thu Jul 12, 2012 8:01 am

Meade wrote:That isn't "gaming the system". Gaming the system requires some amount of operating in bad faith. An example of gaming the system would be when Snoqueen intentionally misrepresents what someone else has said in order to please herself. She plays by her own rules. Like it or lump it.


Are you suggesting the ultra-rich get that way without acting in bad faith at times?

Impossible.


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