What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Races for the Senate, U.S. House, etc. and other issues of national importance.
PaleoLiberal
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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby PaleoLiberal » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:07 pm

Ah, the grammar police strike


Cadfael
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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Cadfael » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:11 pm

fennel wrote:
Cadfael wrote:And yes, that person does deserve credit for putting it into better words than I ...

Than you what?

Than I.

Which is correct, better than I or better than me? — Idrees, Pakistan
Answer
Grammarians have been struggling over "better than I" vs. "better than me" for hundreds of years, and they are not likely to settle the issue anytime soon.
Fortunately, there are two simple rules you can follow that will keep you sounding natural and appropriate to native speakers.
Formal written English: Better than I
In written English, especially in a formal document such as a business letter or a school assignment, most native speakers believe that the subject pronouns I, he, she, we, and they are correct after than. Therefore, if you want to sound educated and correct, it is safer to use “better than I.”
Conversational English: Better than me
In everyday conversation, however, or in text messages and informal emails, most native speakers use the object pronouns me, him, her, us, and them (even if they tell you that they don’t), and if you say “better than I” many people will think that it sounds unnatural and awkward and possibly even pretentious. So in conversation, I recommend that you stick with “better than me.”
I hope this is helpful.

I believe, in this particular case, that the predicate you're looking for is immediate to, and referenced by, the qualifier 'better words' so it is acceptable to end the sentence with "I" as long as there are no further qualifiers. I don't think I said that right, so any grammar technicians feel free to correct me. coughwags.

PaleoLiberal
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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby PaleoLiberal » Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:17 pm

I agree with Cadfael here.

Thing is, there have been several links to songs on Freak Out recently, so I felt compelled to add to the mix.

Nothing wrong with some old fashioned Zappa, to be reviewed by Wags in the year 2137 or so.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Thu Apr 13, 2017 8:01 pm

Cadfael wrote:
fennel wrote:
Cadfael wrote:And yes, that person does deserve credit for putting it into better words than I ...

Than you what?

Than I. . . .

. . . I don't think I said that right, so any grammar technicians feel free to correct me. coughwags.


I think you missed the gist of fennel's friendly gibe, Cadfael.
The issue isn't "I" vs "me" in your original sentence, it's that you left us dangling. While I think it's perfectly understandable what you meant, your sentence doesn't make any real sense grammatically because you fail to tell us what I is up to. Without a(n at least auxiliary) verb, there's no action, state of being, or relationship attached to I, despite setting up the latter by using than. But it isn't that person which is better, it's the words, so you've left your readers wondering what the than is comparing, exactly. Just tacking could (or would have or several other options) on the end would have made everything fine, it seems to me. I suspect this doesn't sound wonky to you because sentences which end similarly to yours but are grammatically correct are relatively common and often sound quite eloquent: "Mister, you're a better man than I" and "There but for the grace of God go I" both come to mind.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Cadfael » Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:10 pm

I think it is quite obvious that the immediately preceding predicate " is the one to be referenced rather than the "does deserve" before it because it's only in that context that the I appears to dangle but I will accept your good natured explanation about Fennel's friendly gibe.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Prof. Wagstaff » Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:34 pm

I should be clear here: I'm in no way an expert on this stuff, nor do I seek to be. As I've mentioned elsewhere, I have little patience for prescriptivist grammarians and your meaning was clear (even to fennel, I'll bet.) I'm willing to bet a real grammarian would make mincemeat out of my argument, I just go by what sounds right and makes the most sense to me. What I do know is that I find language discussions to be fascinating, not to mention a heckuva lot more fun than talking politics in 2017.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Henry Vilas » Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:37 pm

An Oklahoma congressman is facing scrutiny after a video posted Monday showed him telling constituents at a town hall that they do not pay his salary.

"You say you pay for me to do this? That's bull crap. I pay for myself," Rep. Markwayne Mullin told constituents at a town hall in Jay, Oklahoma. I paid enough taxes before I got here and continue to through my company to pay my own salary. This is a service. No one here pays me to go."


A Republican, of course.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby gargantua » Sat Apr 15, 2017 5:53 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
An Oklahoma congressman is facing scrutiny after a video posted Monday showed him telling constituents at a town hall that they do not pay his salary.

"You say you pay for me to do this? That's bull crap. I pay for myself," Rep. Markwayne Mullin told constituents at a town hall in Jay, Oklahoma. I paid enough taxes before I got here and continue to through my company to pay my own salary. This is a service. No one here pays me to go."


A Republican, of course.

What an asshole. I bet his "constituents " are too stupid to vote him out.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Henry Vilas » Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:11 pm

News reports say a Florida state senator used racial slurs and insults in a private after-hours conversation with African-American colleagues.

The reports Tuesday said Miami-area Republican Sen. Frank Artiles used a variation of the "n-word" in the conversation at Tallahassee's Governor's Club with Democratic Sens. Audrey Gibson of Jacksonville and Perry Thurston of Fort Lauderdale. They said Artiles also used obscene and belittling language directed at them in the Monday night conversation.

Gibson said it was the most disrespect she has ever encountered.

I assume he had a few drinks before he went on his rant.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:35 pm


Cadfael
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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Cadfael » Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:57 pm

Republicans exempt their own insurance from their latest health care proposal
Republican legislators want to keep popular Obamacare provisions for themselves and their staff.
That's how horrible Obamacare is. They want to take it away from Ned and Roy and everybody else.

But they keep it.

To repeat: The Republicans want to destroy Obamacare FOR EVERYBODY BUT THEMSELVES.

You conservatives sure know how to pick 'em. I'm looking forward to the excuses you make for the people who are screwing you over royally.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Roy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:11 pm

Cadfael wrote:They want to take it away from Ned and Roy and everybody else.

Neither I, nor any congress person has ACA.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Cadfael » Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:15 pm

Roy wrote:
Cadfael wrote:They want to take it away from Ned and Roy and everybody else.

Neither I, nor any congress person has ACA.

You just keep on thinkin that, sir.

Or research it a little bit, if you have the time.

Or you could read the article I guess. There are certain provisions of the ACA that do indeed pertain to Congress, and they're keeping those.

Not you, though. So never mind. You've got yours, you're sitting pretty. Fuck everybody else.

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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Roy » Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:14 pm

Not me is correct. so yeah, I will never mind.

Cadfael
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Re: What's wrong with the GOP, anyway?

Postby Cadfael » Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:39 pm

Roy wrote:Not me is correct. so yeah, I will never mind.

Actually, you've been wrong about so much recently, and things have changed around you so much without your notice, that I think at least part of your health care could now be under the ACA and if it's repealed you'd get less.

I'd just as soon you got better health care but it's your choice. I'd look into it if I were you, though.


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