An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

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rabble
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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby rabble » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:55 pm

David Blaska wrote: I took a nose full of pepper spray in the protests of the 1960s

The earliest use of pepper spray I can find is 1973.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby snoqueen » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:00 pm

The Father Groppi marches involved police actions -- I don't remember if it was pepper spray or tear gas, but I tend to think at that time it was tear gas. Not much difference, for the purpose of this discussion.

David, I'd like to know where your soul went between then and today. I can't reconcile the idea you marched then, and the way you talk now.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby fennel » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:02 pm

David Blaska wrote:In point of fact, I took a nose full of pepper spray in the protests of the 1960s ...
I suggest you demonstrate your commitment to talking points by enduring a good blast of the same "pepper spray" used at U.C. Davis. My guess is you'll find this is a somewhat different chemical slurry than what was used in the 60s.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby David Blaska » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:07 pm

snoqueen wrote:The Father Groppi marches involved police actions -- I don't remember if it was pepper spray or tear gas, but I tend to think at that time it was tear gas. Not much difference, for the purpose of this discussion.

David, I'd like to know where your soul went between then and today. I can't reconcile the idea you marched then, and the way you talk now.


You'll have to wait for the book. But hope you're not equating Occupy Tentville with the Civil Rights Movement.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:19 pm

rabble wrote:
David Blaska wrote: I took a nose full of pepper spray in the protests of the 1960s

The earliest use of pepper spray I can find is 1973.

It was tear gas. But give give Mr. B a break, as he is around my age. Details fade, but the big events are still sharp in the mind. I got gassed, first at the Dow demonstrations (as a passerby) in Madison. Later in boot camp, just to get the feel (my prior experience didn't give me a pass). Later still at the Kent St./Cambodia protests (or was it the Vietnam Moritorium protest?) both in D.C., while on weekend liberty in the Navy. Like I said, details fail.

Yet Mr. B differentiates from those days to the present.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby David Blaska » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:28 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:It was tear gas. But give give Mr. B a break, as he is around my age. Details fade, but the big events are still sharp in the mind. I got gassed, first at the Dow demonstrations (as a passerby) in Madison. Later in boot camp, just to get the feel (my prior experience didn't give me a pass). Later still at the Kent St./Cambodia protests (or was it the Vietnam Moritorium protest?) both in D.C., while on weekend liberty in the Navy.


It was the 1971 D.C. Moratorium on DuPont circle, I believe. Police in sidecars pumping the stuff! A little hair on the chest. The irony was, we were on the sidewalks, not blocking the roadway.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:31 pm

David Blaska wrote:But hope you're not equating Occupy Tentville with the Civil Rights Movement.

How about all the Hoovervilles during the Great Depression? Or maybe the WWI veterans' Bonus Army during the same time period, whose shacks were burned down by Patton?

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Meade » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:44 pm

I remember the slogan back then: "Girls Say Yes To Boys Who Say No"

I think one of the challenges for these Occupy kids today is they don't really know who or what it is exactly they are saying no to. And why?

What the heck does a guy have to do to make himself a martyr now that the Barack Obamas and Paul Soglins and Linda P. B. Katehis are the authorities? What does it take to get your shack burned down by a Patton?
Last edited by Meade on Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rabble
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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby rabble » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:44 pm

Doesn't matter. The disenfranchised of history get revered.

Today's disenfranchised get what the disenfranchised of history got.

And here we have champions of the former turning coat for the current. The more things change.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Igor » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:45 pm

jjoyce wrote:To be cynical for a second... Point: Occupy.

This is what protests are partially about: images. Push the cops to do something stupid, get it on video and distribute. The result is hopefully that people will be so mortified that they'll side with the protesters, if only because who couldn't be opposed to the hard-to-watch video?


Absolutely. The equivalent of: "I'm not touching you. I'm not touching you. I'm not..." *whack* "MOM, Bobby HIT me!" "BOBBY! Get in here"

The tactic is successful - that is why it is used. The problem in this case is that the protesters have no more of a plan laid out than the kid pressing his big brother's buttons. How can the public swing to your side if you don't have at least one concrete goal? Or is the goal just to continue protesting?

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby David Blaska » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:46 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
David Blaska wrote:But hope you're not equating Occupy Tentville with the Civil Rights Movement.

How about all the Hoovervilles during the Great Depression? Or maybe the WWI veterans' Bonus Army during the same time period, whose shacks were burned down by Patton?


Hope you are not equating the Occupy Villains with the bonus army or the Christians in the Coliseum or the Jews in Nazi Germany or the ...

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Henry Vilas » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:54 pm

David Blaska wrote:Hope you are not equating the Occupy Villains with the bonus army or the Christians in the Coliseum or the Jews in Nazi Germany or the ...

Godwin's Law invoked in a failed attempt to be the thread killer.

Now go back to defending the pepper spraying of passive resisters. Dare you.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby Meade » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:55 pm

Igor wrote:How can the public swing to your side if you don't have at least one concrete goal? Or is the goal just to continue protesting?


Right.

"What Is Our One Demand?"

That's from the original Adbusters ad, the one with the ballet dancer on top of the charging bull. Has anyone come up with one demand yet? Not twenty-one demands. One.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby David Blaska » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:00 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Now go back to defending the pepper spraying of passive resisters. Dare you.


They were not passive. They were actively resisting! Give the kids some credit: they were occupying! They want to do civil disobedience but only on the arcade game module: heroes without discomfort.

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Re: An Article on the Pepper Spray Mentality

Postby David Blaska » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:03 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Now go back to defending the pepper spraying of passive resisters. Dare you.


And while you're at it, please to tell: what were they resisting?


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