The Cannabis Thread

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Igor
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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby Igor » Fri Aug 16, 2013 9:31 am

rabble wrote:
Igor wrote:I don't think that a person that is growing something currently illegal is going to have an issue with some unreported untaxed income. And since we can't enforce the existing laws, I don't think tax enforcement will be much better.

I think a big part of the reason we can't enforce the current laws is because they're so unreasonable they drive everything underground.

If people could buy it over the counter, enough people would want to do it that somebody would come along to grow and sell it above board, pay the tax, and still turn a tidy profit.

Add that to the money we're saving by not throwing stoners in jail.


As a (presumably) controlled substance, there will also be costs - I'm guessing something similar to alcohol. And given that pot is a lot easier to produce than alcohol or cigarettes, I still feel that only 10-30% of the pot produced will get taxed.

rabble
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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Fri Aug 16, 2013 9:38 am

Igor wrote:As a (presumably) controlled substance, there will also be costs - I'm guessing something similar to alcohol. And given that pot is a lot easier to produce than alcohol or cigarettes, I still feel that only 10-30% of the pot produced will get taxed.

Maybe. Especially at first. That would be fine with me.

Hell, just plugging that damned "war on pot" money hole would be what, a few billion a year?

DCB
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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby DCB » Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:19 am

rabble wrote:Hell, just plugging that damned "war on pot" money hole would be what, a few billion a year?

It might put a serious dent in the coffers of the Mexican drug cartels.

Also the social cost of removing a million young adult (mostly Black) males from society.

rabble
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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:21 am

Christie OKs medical marijuana bill for ill children
Basically, I'll allow it but I'm limiting the supply to less than we'll actually need once word gets out that it works, and you have to jump through more hoops than those other hippie states to get it. A LOT more hoops.

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby fisticuffs » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:33 am

rabble wrote:Christie OKs medical marijuana bill for ill children
Basically, I'll allow it but I'm limiting the supply to less than we'll actually need once word gets out that it works, and you have to jump through more hoops than those other hippie states to get it. A LOT more hoops.


You're probably right but it does go to show Christie may be the only Republican with his head out of his ass politically. While they are all trying to out crazy each other Christie is playing to the middle. Good thing that any deviation from Republican orthodoxy eliminates you from winning the nomination and firmly plants you as a RINO for the rest of eternity (or until FOX says it's OK to support him again).

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:40 am

rabble wrote:Christie OKs medical marijuana bill for ill children
Basically, I'll allow it but I'm limiting the supply to less than we'll actually need once word gets out that it works, and you have to jump through more hoops than those other hippie states to get it. A LOT more hoops.


Odd article in general; considering the topic was medical use I'm not sure why the author felt the need to state not once but twice that
Washington and Colorado are the only two states to allow adults to possess marijuana for recreational use.


It also did a piss poor job of explaining why Christie was responsible for the 2 doctor sign-off in the bill rather then the legislators who wrote it and didn't explain the cause of the shortage in supply.

rabble
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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:11 am

fisticuffs wrote:You're probably right but it does go to show Christie may be the only Republican with his head out of his ass politically. While they are all trying to out crazy each other Christie is playing to the middle. Good thing that any deviation from Republican orthodoxy eliminates you from winning the nomination and firmly plants you as a RINO for the rest of eternity (or until FOX says it's OK to support him again).

Right now he's the only Republican to publicly admit the stuff might not be as bad as they say and what the hell, the "they" right now is Obama. He'd never try that if a Republican was in the White House no matter how many fathers of sick kids pleaded with him for their children's lives.

And for anybody who thinks he'd behave this way once he got elected President, I got a bridge for sale cheap.

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby johnfajardohenry » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:32 am

DCB wrote:
rabble wrote:Hell, just plugging that damned "war on pot" money hole would be what, a few billion a year?

It might put a serious dent in the coffers of the Mexican drug cartels.


I've been pretty outspoken about legalizing MJ for 40 years and more. Part of the reason is because of all the crime it's illegality causes. I'd legalize cocaine and heroin as well for the same reasons.

Doing so would put all these cartels out of the drug business.

Would it really put them out of business, though? Do you think they are going to go quietly away?

Some, perhaps, but I think many will turn to other types of crime theft, kidnapping, extortion and the like.

Maybe even drugs. Alcohol is legal and yet there is still a fair amount of bootlegging.

Not a reason not to legalize but something that must be borne in mind.

John Henry

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Wed Aug 21, 2013 3:00 pm

DCB wrote:
rabble wrote:Hell, just plugging that damned "war on pot" money hole would be what, a few billion a year?

It might put a serious dent in the coffers of the Mexican drug cartels.

Also the social cost of removing a million young adult (mostly Black) males from society.


The Budgetary Implications of Marijuana Prohibition June, 2005
The report estimates that legalizing marijuana would save $7.7 billion per year in government expenditure on enforcement of prohibition. $5.3 billion of this savings would accrue to state and local governments, while $2.4 billion would accrue to the federal government.


It also says we could pull in another 6 billion in taxes but I agree that part might be wishful thinking. Definitely though, we stand to gain almost 8 billion in 2005 dollars just by legalizing.

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby gozer » Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:36 am

the american medical association used to be very in favour of marijuana-based medications and i believe it was until 1943 -- six years after it was effectively outlawed -- that it was listed in the united states pharmacopoeia. a sensible first step, to try for a few years to see what happens and prove the puritan arseholes wrong would be as follows

* dilute tincture of cannabis -- schedule v, rx or otc on state-by-state basis like codeine cough syrup
* concentrated tinctures of cannabis -- schedule iv
* tinctures of cannabis with one or more active non-controlled ingredient: decontrolled, rx
* purified (−)-trans-Δ-9-tetrahydrocannabinol-- schedule iii
* purified (−)-trans-Δ-3-tetrahydrocannabinol-- schedule iv
* dronabiniol (marinol®) -- decontrolled rx or otc (or not made anymore because it sucks)
* cannabidiol and any marijuana in which this predominates -- decontrolled, rx or otc on state-by-state basis like pseudoephedrine
* any of the other 85 cannabinoids -- decontrolled
* hashish -- schedule iii
* hash oil -- schedule iii or iv
* marijuana prepared for vapourisation, inhalers &c -- schedule iv
* marijuana prepared for smoking -- schedule iv
* other edible products -- schedule v, rx or otc on state-by-state basis like codeine cough syrup
* cannabis-opium mixture (for control of nausea from opium) -- schedule iii
* brompton cocktail including tincture of cannabis or pure thc -- schedule ii
* active mixtures using dmso to drive cannabinoids through the skin -- otc
* injectable cannabis alkaloids hydrochlorides or the like (the pantopon analogue of weed) -- schedule v rx

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby johnfajardohenry » Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:24 pm

rabble wrote:
Igor wrote:I don't really have a problem with pot legalization, but I also don't buy the "taxing pot will fix the budget" argument either.

I can't recall anybody saying it will fix the budget all by itself. Do you mean you don't think it will help?


Taxing pot will help a bit though probably not all that much. It is not like booze that is hard to make. If taxes are too high, people will just grow their own.

What will really help the budget is the reduced spending on enforcement of out stupid drug laws.

John Henry

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby Madsci » Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:07 pm

Ya, we got ditch weed. And yes I did a scientific analysis to make sure it was hemp not herb. Too bad because it does have the right smell and the buds were huge. Haven't found any this year yet. I wonder how long the seeds are viable?

As a side note, I once found hemp growing on Governor's Island back in the 80s. And oh, don't tax my crops!

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby eriedasch » Wed Aug 28, 2013 6:36 pm

http://www.examiner.com/article/punitiv ... signs-seat

WI Republicans have an idea how to waste even more WI tax dollars on low level pot users.

Meanwhile WI already has some of the harshest most extreme pot laws in the Midwest putting those arrested for 2nd offense (any amount in your entire life) in prison up to 3.5 years.

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:59 pm

Obama administration to allow recreational marijuana laws to stand
The Justice Department said it will not seek to veto new state laws in Colorado and Washington that legalize the recreational use of marijuana, and it will not bring federal prosecutions against dispensaries or businesses that sell small amounts of marijuana to adults.

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Re: The Cannabis Thread

Postby rabble » Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:57 pm

Christie loans $357,000 to a medicinal marijuana dispensary in Egg Harbor Township that plans to open in mid-October.

Bill Thomas, the chief executive of Compassionate Care Foundation Inc., said the dispensary would use the money to buy equipment and expand the area where it will cultivate the drug, add 12 jobs to the seven it had already created, and eventually produce enough for about 1,500 patients a month.

Within 10 years, said Thomas, a former medical researcher, the dispensary expected to generate about $2.8 million a year in state sales taxes.

But we know that won't happen because the Republicans have sworn up and down that it's impossible to expand and create jobs in the current oppressive tax system.


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