The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

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Remember_Me
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Remember_Me » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:21 pm

Wow. Maybe Zimmerman was in fear of his life.

This was purportedly taken by police 3 minutes after the shooting of Martin:

Image

Stebben84
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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:34 pm

Remember_Me wrote:Wow. Maybe Zimmerman was in fear of his life.


And maybe Zimmerman started the altercation and it was Trayvon trying to defend HIMSELF.

And by the way, if you've ever cut your head just a little, it bleeds like a motherfucker. I'm not being the jury here. It's just that people are going to now look at this and say, "AHA. See. He needed to shoot him."

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Meade » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:53 pm

Stebben84 wrote:I'm not being the jury here.

Oh? Earlier in this thread you sure seemed willing to be the jury:

Stebben84 wrote:
acereraser wrote:Zimmerman crawled to the grass, dragging Martin along with him.


The ambulance people washed and ironed his clothes, then gave him a bubble bath.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Dangerousman » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:27 pm

Stebben84 wrote:And maybe Zimmerman started the altercation and it was Trayvon trying to defend HIMSELF.


Maybe, and maybe ninjas attacked and disappeared without a trace into the dark.

But the jury is going to be instructed to consider the evidence that is presented in court. If you watched the Zimmerman bail hearing this morning the defense attorney asked the state's investigator whether they had any evidence whatsoever that contradicted Zimmerman's statement that Martin attacked him. The detective said "no."

Also mentioned was that the evidence showed the gunshot happened at contact or near contact range. If one intended to simply shoot someone from the front one would usually neither need nor choose to get that close. Or is it your theory that Zimmerman thought "Hey, I've already called the police, so I know they're on the way. Meanwhile, I think I'll go out of my way to start a physical fight with a guy who is 6 or 7 inches taller than I am, so that when I'm getting my ass kicked I'll have an excuse to shoot him, and I'll have wounds to back up my story." ? Is that how it went down?

Who attacked first is a critical element. If the police have no evidence other than Zimmerman's statement, and nothing to contradict his statement, how strong of a case is that? The defense will more than likely point out the physical evidence that is consistent with Zimmerman's statement along with the witness(es?) who told the police that the guy in the red (Zimmerman) was on the ground underneath the other guy. Those wounds and witness statements don't prove who started it, but they certainly don't disprove Zimmerman's statement. The state has the burden proof and "beyond a reasonable doubt" is a substantial burden.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:32 pm

Dangerousman wrote:Maybe, and maybe ninjas attacked and disappeared without a trace into the dark.


Gosh, I'm sorry. Were you there? You now seem to know so much about the case watching tv as you previously shit on other people for making assumptions.

Dangerousman wrote: If one intended to simply shoot someone from the front one would usually neither need nor choose to get that close. Or is it your theory that Zimmerman thought "Hey, I've already called the police, so I know they're on the way. Meanwhile, I think I'll go out of my way to start a physical fight with a guy who is 6 or 7 inches taller than I am, so that when I'm getting my ass kicked I'll have an excuse to shoot him, and I'll have wounds to back up my story." ? Is that how it went down?


I don't know, but you seem to. Tell me what else was Zimmerman thinking.

Dangerousman wrote:But the jury is going to be instructed to consider the evidence that is presented in court.


Exactly. You should listen to your own advice. But, I already know who you are an apologist for so I guess it doesn't matter.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby fisticuffs » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:35 pm

Who attacked first is a critical element.


Not in Florida thanks to the NRA. If Zimmerman was pursuing and Travon feel threatened according to the states stand your ground law he had every right to turn around and clock him. Self defense goes out the window when you provoke the situation. Sweet irony it would be if Zimmerman loses self defense because of Martin's new right to strike first.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:45 pm

Dangerousman wrote:But the jury is going to be instructed to consider the evidence that is presented in court. If you watched the Zimmerman bail hearing this morning the defense attorney asked the state's investigator whether they had any evidence whatsoever that contradicted Zimmerman's statement that Martin attacked him. The detective said "no."

Yes, Martin cannot give testimony. And Zimmerman was released with his gun and his clothes not held for evidence. Poor police work made sure that any evidence that might contradict Zimmerman is missing from this case.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Ned Flanders » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:55 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:Yes, Martin cannot give testimony. And Zimmerman was released with his gun and his clothes not held for evidence. Poor police work made sure that any evidence that might contradict Zimmerman is missing from this case.

Yep. Listen to Hank. He's seen every episode of Murder She Wrote.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:58 pm

Ned Flanders wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote:Yes, Martin cannot give testimony. And Zimmerman was released with his gun and his clothes not held for evidence. Poor police work made sure that any evidence that might contradict Zimmerman is missing from this case.

Yep. Listen to Hank. He's seen every episode of Murder She Wrote.

Fuck off, troll.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Ned Flanders » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:05 pm

Henry Vilas wrote:
Ned Flanders wrote:
Henry Vilas wrote:Yes, Martin cannot give testimony. And Zimmerman was released with his gun and his clothes not held for evidence. Poor police work made sure that any evidence that might contradict Zimmerman is missing from this case.

Yep. Listen to Hank. He's seen every episode of Murder She Wrote.

Fuck off, troll.

Hopefully, when they find "those pictures" on your hard drive, you can get a trial by mob. See how you like it.
Last edited by Ned Flanders on Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Henry Vilas » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:07 pm

The Troll is proving my point.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Dangerousman » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:18 pm

Stebben84 wrote:
Dangerousman wrote:Maybe, and maybe ninjas attacked and disappeared without a trace into the dark.


Gosh, I'm sorry. Were you there? You now seem to know so much about the case watching tv as you previously shit on other people for making assumptions.

Dangerousman wrote: If one intended to simply shoot someone from the front one would usually neither need nor choose to get that close. Or is it your theory that Zimmerman thought "Hey, I've already called the police, so I know they're on the way. Meanwhile, I think I'll go out of my way to start a physical fight with a guy who is 6 or 7 inches taller than I am, so that when I'm getting my ass kicked I'll have an excuse to shoot him, and I'll have wounds to back up my story." ? Is that how it went down?


I don't know, but you seem to. Tell me what else was Zimmerman thinking.

Dangerousman wrote:But the jury is going to be instructed to consider the evidence that is presented in court.


Exactly. You should listen to your own advice. But, I already know who you are an apologist for so I guess it doesn't matter.


Apparently you don't understand sarcasm. What conclusions have I drawn above? I merely pointed out the difficulty in drawing conclusions, in particular of the type you're proposing without anything to back it up. I'm consistent in insisting that one objectively consider the facts and to keep an open mind, whereas you're eager to join the witch hunt and find the boogeyman anywhere you imagine he might lurk. The difference is I want to look at both sides of a coin, and you don't believe the coin has more than one side.

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Stebben84 » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:13 pm

Dangerousman wrote: The difference is I want to look at both sides of a coin, and you don't believe the coin has more than one side.


I've yet to see you look at the Trayvon side of the coin. Maybe I missed it.

For the record here is what I said. Don't skew my opinions

Stebben84 wrote:
I'm not jumping to conclusions either. As I said, I'm glad this is going to trial so we can get the truth. I don't think we had that before and if he is acquitted I will stand by that judgement.


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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Dangerousman » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:59 pm

Stebben84 wrote:
Dangerousman wrote: The difference is I want to look at both sides of a coin, and you don't believe the coin has more than one side.


I've yet to see you look at the Trayvon side of the coin. Maybe I missed it.

For the record here is what I said. Don't skew my opinions

Stebben84 wrote:
I'm not jumping to conclusions either. As I said, I'm glad this is going to trial so we can get the truth. I don't think we had that before and if he is acquitted I will stand by that judgement.



Do you propose, as an example of your "not jumping to conclusions" that we ought to include when you wrote regarding Zimmerman that it was, "So unbelievably clear that his head wasn't "bashed on the curb" and if it was, he would have at very least a band aid. If he had a broken nose, you would clearly be able to see. There may have been a scuffle, but getting beat up to the point of killing someone, not even close."

Is your conclusion-- that you did not jump to-- that Zimmerman didn't have his head bashed still "unbelievably clear" to you?

As far as looking at the "Trayvon side of the coin," I wasn't aware that Trayvon has made any statements that one can evaluate against the other evidence. My invitation to the seance must have gotten lost in the mail. Perhaps you will kindly inform us? What has he told you? And the question everyone wants to know: Was Elvis there, too?

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Re: The Trayvon Martin & George Zimmerman Story

Postby Dangerousman » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:10 pm

Henry Vilas wrote: Zimmerman was released with his gun and his clothes not held for evidence.


What is your basis for claiming that Zimmerman's gun was released to him and not held for evidence?


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