Can someone explain this picture to me?

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Francis Di Domizio
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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:28 am

wack wack wrote:I've said it here before, I'll say it again: the private union member who voted against public unions is the most despicable of all.


To be fair, at some point the election stopped being about Act 10 and started being about what a dick Walker is, and how he might be under investigation. I'm not sure if Falk's pledge (and the subsequent backlash) was that point or if it was when Barrett entered the race as the front runner and democratic leadership realized Barrett's use of Act 10 might screw up being able to use that attack or if it happened before either of those two events.

The point being, Act 10 stopped being the main message, and frankly I'm not certain one singular message was ever created. If you want to look at the biggest strength the GOP has over Democrats it that they are great at creating a message and staying on it.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby lukpac » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:30 am

snoqueen wrote:Racine County, which appears to have voted Van Wangaard out, is the home of UW-Parkside.


Parkside is in Kenosha County, although the idea of the school was to serve both counties.

snoqueen wrote:Menominee County is the old Menominee Indian Reservation.


It isn't "old" - it is still (mostly) the reservation.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Meade » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:33 am

Francis Di Domizio wrote:If you want to look at the biggest strength the GOP has over Democrats it that they are great at creating a message and staying on it.

I think you are on to something important.

Why were Walker supporters so adept at staying on message?

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby fisticuffs » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:35 am

Why were Walker supporters so adept at staying on message?


The coordinated use of up to $80 millions dollars mostly from out of state, and the complete lack of shame the donors have when it comes to lining their pockets.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby wack wack » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:37 am

Francis Di Domizio wrote:
wack wack wrote:I've said it here before, I'll say it again: the private union member who voted against public unions is the most despicable of all.


To be fair, at some point the election stopped being about Act 10 and started being about what a dick Walker is, and how he might be under investigation. I'm not sure if Falk's pledge (and the subsequent backlash) was that point or if it was when Barrett entered the race as the front runner and democratic leadership realized Barrett's use of Act 10 might screw up being able to use that attack or if it happened before either of those two events.

The point being, Act 10 stopped being the main message, and frankly I'm not certain one singular message was ever created. If you want to look at the biggest strength the GOP has over Democrats it that they are great at creating a message and staying on it.


You asked for my feelings on private unions, I stated them. I don't think it was all about unions either.

No, I think it was all about "me, me, me!" for red Wisconsin. They bought the message that felt good, despite the fact that plenty of evidence was available to the contrary, and as long as the parties getting screwed were "not ME," they were fine with it.

The strength in the Republican message is it's ability to capture the fearful and ignorant.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Zoti Bemba » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:00 am

nutria wrote:Sure, CB, I'll explain it to you. You see, what you posted is a map, and this one in particular is a map of Wisconsin. Each of the small areas on this map are called counties. You'll notice, that each of these counties is one of two different colors, red or blue. Now, you're probably wondering why each of these counties is a different color, and in particular, why red or blue? Well, CB, recently Wisconsin had an election and the different color of those counties signify which of the two major candidates received the most votes in that county. Now, here's where you'll want to pay special attention. You'll notice a smaller box in the top right portion of the map. This is called the key. What the key does is tell the map's viewer what the different shapes, lines, or in this case, colors, on the map represent. You'll notice that one of the candidate is in a red box, and the other has a blue box near his name. Now, and this is the crucial part, the candidate in the red box received the majority of the votes in the counties colored red. And, and this might not be obvious, but the candidate with the blue box near his name received the majority of votes in the counties colored blue. Right now, you're probably asking yourself, "how did the red counties know to vote for the red candidate?" That's what's interesting about this map. The counties aren't actually red or blue in real life. I'll give you a moment to let that sink in. Those colors were filled in after the election.

I hope my explanation has helped you. If not, just let me know, and I'll be happy to slow it down for you.


You forgot to explain the part where the size of the county on the map has nothing to do with the number of people who voted in the election. Milwaukee County, for example, looks very small on the map but it includes many, many, many more voters than counties that cover a larger area. A map like this can tell you which candidate won each county's vote and where the county is located, but not how many people voted in the county or the difference between the candidates in the final vote tally.

Personally I find the interactive maps that give results and percentages when the cursor hovers over the county far more interesting and enlightening. If I could find ward-by-ward results, that would be better yet.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Earthling » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:18 am

Galoot wrote:
wack wack wrote:It tells me that, just like the FIBs every weekend, I'll be breezing past the worthless parts of the state on my way to the far north country.


You, and a LOT of other people too. I'm leaving the state, of course, but I've heard from a lot of local friends, who regularly go up to the North Woods in the summer, and even for some skiing in the winter too. It's common to stop on the way up for a fish fry and a beer before going the last stretch, and I'm sure those restaurants are going to see a significant drop in tourist visits for a while.

In fact, they'll likely just buy the weekend's supply of beer locally rather than subsidize some North Woods Walker voters.


You're probably right

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Zoti Bemba » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:27 am

wack wack wrote:The strength in the Republican message is it's ability to capture the fearful and ignorant.


What I noticed was that Walker and his allies tended to focus on "big picture" statements that are very hard for individuals to verify based on their daily lives (how is anyone really supposed to know how many jobs were really created in the state, even if you are looking for one, or what crime is like in Milwaukee if you don't live there?) and to chip away at the edges where their policies are dead set against Wisconsin values (education, democracy). Cutting education became a "tough choice", undermining collective bargaining became "fairness", teachers became a "special interest" and if anyone was still wondering about the wisdom of all this (I mean, come on, we're cutting education here), don't worry because our harsh measures are working and, magically, schools now have even more money than they did before we cut education and left the poorer districts to go fend for themselves (Sink or swim: it's an individual choice!). So don't worry, and now let's change the subject to those hippy union thug protesters who despoiled our Capitol... :evil:

It's hard to argue against these messages because a lot of these "facts" are hard to know or to independently verify. And I give the red voters some credit: some of them at least needed some reassurance that it wasn't all about stomping on the opposition, that some of the values we all share were still being honored. Of course those reassurances were lies, but I might have accepted them too if I hadn't been primed to think and question as well as listen.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Bludgeon » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:48 am

Cornbread wrote:and please don't use the leftist BS meaningless slogans like "the rich" or "corporations" or "racists!" or "hate women" or the next bumpersticker ya'll will pull out of your trunk.

Look at this map.
Whatcha think?

Image

This pretty much sums it up:
Michael Barone wrote:Even before the results came in, we knew one thing, and that is that the Democrats and the public employee unions had already lost the battle of ideas over the issue that sparked the recall, Walker's legislation to restrict the bargaining powers of public employee unions.

That's supported by a Marquette University poll showing 75 percent of Wisconsin voters favoring increases in public employees' contributions for health care and pensions. It also showed 55 percent for limiting collective bargaining for public employees and only 41 percent opposed.

But the strongest evidence is that Barrett and the Democrats avoided the issue.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Stebben84 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:42 pm

Bludgeon wrote:This pretty much sums it up:


Could we get a link. I like reading the full article and it's actually the board rules. Not tryin' to be a dick.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Francis Di Domizio » Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:49 pm

wack wack wrote:No, I think it was all about "me, me, me!" for red Wisconsin. They bought the message that felt good, despite the fact that plenty of evidence was available to the contrary, and as long as the parties getting screwed were "not ME," they were fine with it.

The strength in the Republican message is it's ability to capture the fearful and ignorant.


That may be how they get the message to work, but the strength comes from it's focus. Almost everything they put out hit on a central theme: "It's Working". They drilled that in with claims of new job numbers, schools making budget despite cuts, reduced property taxes. On the other hand the democrats threw out reason after reason why Walker had to go, but rather than driving home any one point they went for breadth without making an overwhelming argument for any of the justifications.

Maybe it says something nice about the intellect of democratic voters that they can figure out things without having them drilled into them. Unfortunately not winning the recall says something entirely different.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby wack wack » Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:54 pm

Francis Di Domizio wrote:That may be how they get the message to work, but the strength comes from it's focus. Almost everything they put out hit on a central theme: "It's Working". They drilled that in with claims of new job numbers, schools making budget despite cuts, reduced property taxes. On the other hand the democrats threw out reason after reason why Walker had to go, but rather than driving home any one point they went for breadth without making an overwhelming argument for any of the justifications.

Maybe it says something nice about the intellect of democratic voters that they can figure out things without having them drilled into them. Unfortunately not winning the recall says something entirely different.


With this, dear Domizio, I heartily agree.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Rich Schultz » Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:14 pm

Earthling wrote:
Galoot wrote:
wack wack wrote:It tells me that, just like the FIBs every weekend, I'll be breezing past the worthless parts of the state on my way to the far north country.


You, and a LOT of other people too. I'm leaving the state, of course, but I've heard from a lot of local friends, who regularly go up to the North Woods in the summer, and even for some skiing in the winter too. It's common to stop on the way up for a fish fry and a beer before going the last stretch, and I'm sure those restaurants are going to see a significant drop in tourist visits for a while.

In fact, they'll likely just buy the weekend's supply of beer locally rather than subsidize some North Woods Walker voters.


You're probably right


That's a lovely image, liberals speeding through the northern night, windows rolled up tight, desperately hoping the car doesn't run out of gas. If only they can make it to Bayfield without encountering the roaming lynch mobs out for recall revenge, passing up pie in Osseo, fish fries in Chippewa Falls, beer in Bloomer and bears in the Chequamegon. Ride, brave liberals, let no doubt penetrate that impenetrable skull or erase that permanent scowl. As for the rest of us, we won't miss you at all.
Last edited by Rich Schultz on Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby Bludgeon » Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:16 pm

Stebben84 wrote:
Bludgeon wrote:This pretty much sums it up:


Could we get a link. I like reading the full article and it's actually the board rules. Not tryin' to be a dick.


Sorry, I'm a bit rusty after months and months of Swtor ;) http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articl ... 14398.html

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Re: Can someone explain this picture to me?

Postby pjbogart » Thu Jun 07, 2012 2:17 pm

Stebben84 wrote:
Bludgeon wrote:This pretty much sums it up:


Could we get a link. I like reading the full article and it's actually the board rules. Not tryin' to be a dick.


Well, the quote is from Michael Barone, senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute and political commentator for FoxNews. Barone solidified his credentials as a "fair and balanced" commentator in 2008 when he suggested that journalists hate Sarah Palin because she didn't abort her Down Syndrome baby. Apparently, not only do journalists love abortions, they hate people who choose not to have them.

Are his statistics correct? They might be, but I wouldn't assume that anything coming from AEI is factual, much less so if it came from Michael Barone.

Barone: Media wanted Palin abortion


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