Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

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jman111
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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby jman111 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:46 am

jjoyce wrote:Has Blaska said anything that the union guys aren't saying?

Well, Jason, let's see.
Blaska wrote:...all government unions in the State of Wisconsin will be outlawed.

Bryan Kennedy wrote:This is a shocking development. It ends collective bargaining for public employees in our state ... (from your link)

Yep. It seems Blaska HAS said things that NOBODY else is saying.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby jjoyce » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:59 am

jman: You're being disingenuous. Blaska publicly walked back from that assertion. I know you like to parse like a Clinton, but when someone's transparent about taking back a statement, then you can't exactly pretend it never happened yourself.

Union leaders are mobilizing at full speed this morning under a worst-case-scenario assumption. When will someone at least begrudgingly admit, after a pasting in November and now this, that Blaska is on to something when it comes to public sentiment?

Doesn't make the proposal just. Doesn't make Walker a good governor. Doesn't mean the backlash won't be stronger than the tea party movement. But right now, these posts are accurate.

The presser starts in two minutes, by my watch. We'll know more soon.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby jman111 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:22 am

Jason- I understand you have a vested interest in defending Blaska, but you can't be serious. You legitimate his usual tactic of spewing outright lies simply because he "walked back"? Did you read Endo's post? You don't see sensationalism in Blaska's original post? And you call me disingenuous?

If this were an isolated incident, I would be much less critical. Sadly, this appears to be his usual MO. Well, with your recent postings questioning lack of traffic here, I guess I understand. Anything to get hits, right?

I give him full credit for breaking the story first (from what I can tell), but I give him no credit for honesty.

By the way, what public sentiment is he on to? Care to be more specific?

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby gargantua » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:00 pm

jjoyce wrote:When will someone at least begrudgingly admit, after a pasting in November and now this, that Blaska is on to something when it comes to public sentiment?


Sure, I will. I have said similar things on other threads, specifically that even some of my friends, Madison people, are so bitter about the benefits state employees have that it is something we never talk about. I got to retire in my 50's. Some of these folks don't think they will EVER be able to retire. They pay so much for crappy health insurance with high deductibles that I don't know how they get by. Anyone who thinks that the unions will win public support in this environment is dreaming.

By the way, I'm not a Blaska fan. But sometimes he's right about how a significant number of people feel about things.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby talagaster » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:39 pm

gargantua wrote:Sure, I will. I have said similar things on other threads, specifically that even some of my friends, Madison people, are so bitter about the benefits state employees have that it is something we never talk about. I got to retire in my 50's. Some of these folks don't think they will EVER be able to retire. They pay so much for crappy health insurance with high deductibles that I don't know how they get by. Anyone who thinks that the unions will win public support in this environment is dreaming.


Yep, the right has been very successful at redirecting rage away from those who have beaten down the middle and working classes of this country. Instead of a mass movement of the have-nots against the haves, it's now the have-nots against the have-slightly-more-than the have-nots.

It's a great bit of misdirection on Walker's part, ignore the massive tax cuts over here, it's EVIL STATE WORKERS who are the cause of financial woes. Don't storm the mansion, storm the house of your neighbor who has the audacity of having only one mortgage on his house.

Blaska is just a representation of this faux-populism. At least he's upfront about his muck-raking, I prefer it to the style of Christian Schneider where he tries to hide his unrelenting hatred of government in-between jokes.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby Mean Scenester » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:41 pm

jjoyce wrote:When will someone at least begrudgingly admit, after a pasting in November and now this, that Blaska is on to something when it comes to public sentiment?

Yeah, who would ever have guessed Blaska would have his finger on the pulse of the lowest common denominator?

New flash: Idiots who vote against their own best interests think unions suck.

This isn't a scoop. It's something every public sector employee has smelled coming since November. Blaska got the date right but whiffed on the specifics. In print journalism, that mistake would be followed by a big ol' helping of crow in the form of a printed retraction. In the blogosphere it's dusted under the digital rug with a shrug that suggests, "What's the big deal? He got it right eventually."

Most of us don't read Blaska's opinion droppings at all, much less return to the same miserable piece time and again to check and see if he's gotten his shit together yet.

They're called standards, Isthmus. Got any anymore?

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby snoqueen » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:07 pm

A journalist's (or columnist's, or blogger's) reputation rests on his overall accuracy, completeness, and fairness not on one scoop or even on one error.

Right now Blaska is +1 for the union story and minus several hundred for his inabiity to argue using the facts instead of depending on an intimidating and nasty style to satisfy his urges as an older male primate.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby jman111 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:26 pm

Well stated, sno.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby jjoyce » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:42 pm

Here's what's sticking with me most. Blaska, a former state administrator, joins with others who complain about the union-protected workers who can't be fired and, instead, are just tolerated.

One could argue that this morning's moves by Scott Walker might be just, they might be necessary. But they won't take care of the guy Blaska talks about who should, but can't be fired. Because what's happening right now is that hundreds of qualified and valuable state workers are polishing their resumes. They're looking for jobs elsewhere. They'll be gone, and maybe even to another state, before spring. Meanwhile, guess who's not going anywhere?

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby supaunknown » Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:11 pm

So, what exactly are you suggesting Jason? That gov jobs do away with seniority and make everything performance based?
Last edited by supaunknown on Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby TheBookPolice » Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:30 pm

jjoyce wrote:Blaska, a former state administrator, joins with others who complain about the union-protected workers who can't be fired and, instead, are just tolerated.

Unfortunately, Jason, this is typical underinformed commentary on perceived union invulnerability. From my CBA, under Management Rights:

D. To suspend, demote, discharge or take other appropriate disciplinary action against employees for just cause.

Call me a Pollyanna, but if an employee is so bad that he or she should be fired, he or she will be fired--certainly, he or she can be fired. Any supervisor/manager/whatever who doesn't take that step is the delinquent one.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby Detritus » Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:34 pm

jjoyce wrote:One could argue that this morning's moves by Scott Walker might be just, they might be necessary.

OK, jj, let's see "one" argue that. You, specifically. How is a move to deny state workers the right to collective bargaining "just and necessary?" Oh, and see if you can do it without implying that "many" state workers are deadwood on the public dole, as you just did.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby Madsci » Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:36 pm

Neither have a lot of cred in my book but I do read and enjoy the Isthmus and TDP. Blaska's column is never read by these eyes and his ranting on the TDP are skipped.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby gargantua » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:24 pm

TheBookPolice wrote:
jjoyce wrote:Blaska, a former state administrator, joins with others who complain about the union-protected workers who can't be fired and, instead, are just tolerated.

Unfortunately, Jason, this is typical underinformed commentary on perceived union invulnerability. From my CBA, under Management Rights:

D. To suspend, demote, discharge or take other appropriate disciplinary action against employees for just cause.

Call me a Pollyanna, but if an employee is so bad that he or she should be fired, he or she will be fired--certainly, he or she can be fired. Any supervisor/manager/whatever who doesn't take that step is the delinquent one.


Were you ever a supervisor in state service TBP? If you had, you'd have found out what an imposing standard those three words, "for just cause" have become. If an employee gets past probation, it is an extremely difficult task to fire them. You have to go through all sorts of intermediate steps, document everything, and not make one single mistake while going through the process. In my 20-plus years as a state manager, I can guarantee you that there is no harder, and longer task.

This is sort of beside the point, since 99% of state workers aren't in that category. And I'm not saying it should be easy to take someone's job away. But it shouldn't be next to impossible either.

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Re: Blaska and Isthmus's credibility

Postby Detritus » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:25 am

Detritus wrote:
jjoyce wrote:One could argue that this morning's moves by Scott Walker might be just, they might be necessary.

OK, jj, let's see "one" argue that. You, specifically. How is a move to deny state workers the right to collective bargaining "just and necessary?" Oh, and see if you can do it without implying that "many" state workers are deadwood on the public dole, as you just did.

Yo, jj, still waiting here for you. Or do you prefer to let Blaska speak for you so you can tsk tsk his verbiage but approve of his sentiment?


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