the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Who's making noise in and around Madison? What's new in the business of making music around town? Review shows and CDs here. Please keep all hype in Hype Exchange.
defactobrigade
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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby defactobrigade » Tue Jul 13, 2010 2:53 pm

charliedon'tsurf wrote:
Kenneth Burns wrote:
defactobrigade wrote:I AGREE completely with this. I think the people at the Isthmus have a serious problem when people (heaven forbid) swear at other people. I got a VERY similar statement from Kenneth when I let one Isthmus staffer know how I felt about his horrible pseudo-journalism.


Huh, what was that?

I love swearing. Misogyny, not so much.


It is a gender specific insult, not an indicator of misogyny. Have you ever called a women a dick? Yeah me neither.


I THINK I agree with the sarcasm from Jake...I think he's being Sarcastic. I mean for christ's sake I call women Dicks on a daily basis. It's just a word people.

Kenneth...You don't remember berating me for my profanity in an e-mail? Hmmm. I do.
Jeesh - What do they have in the water cooler over at the Isthmus....I WANT SOME.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby Kenneth Burns » Tue Jul 13, 2010 2:56 pm

defactobrigade wrote:Kenneth...You don't remember berating me for my profanity in an e-mail? Hmmm. I do.

No. I don't know who you are.

defactobrigade
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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby defactobrigade » Tue Jul 13, 2010 3:00 pm

Kenneth Burns wrote:
defactobrigade wrote:Kenneth...You don't remember berating me for my profanity in an e-mail? Hmmm. I do.

No. I don't know who you are.

haha. I'm a nobody, so it doesn't matter.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby Kenneth Burns » Tue Jul 13, 2010 3:04 pm

charliedon'tsurf wrote:It is a gender specific insult, not an indicator of misogyny. Have you ever called a women a dick? Yeah me neither.


Smarter people than us can have a debate about whether there's just a teense of misogyny to: "Anyway, I tell them both to fuck off and call her a 'worthless cunt.'"

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby jman111 » Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:08 pm

Kenneth Burns wrote:Smarter people than us can have a debate about whether there's just a teense of misogyny to: "Anyway, I tell them both to fuck off and call her a 'worthless cunt.'"


Count me in! :D
Would it be misogynistic if the term used was "worthless piece of shit"?

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby Mad Genius » Wed Jul 14, 2010 10:02 am

There are far more clever ways to win the poster slamdance, people.

After declaring war on Tag (I now actually consider him a nice, if locally misunderstood fellow) I earned kudos from passers-by and show attendance by using the kiosks in unusual ways that still managed to be legal (I checked.)

For example:

1. Using cardboard and the sheer bulk of posters for leverage, I created a little flagpole from which my notice hung perpendicular from the surface of the top row, ensuring more views than Tag's shows while not actually touching any True Endeavors posters. Nothing he could do ethically.

2. Again, using cardboard, I put the poster vertically on the top of the kiosk, above the top row, flying proudly all on it's own.

It took me an additional hour to prepare these posters, but it was totally worth it as I sipped my Italian soda peacefully at Espresso Royale while I watched Tag wander State Street helplessly stuck with a bewildered look on his face.

3. Printing my poster information on see-through overhead projector sheets, placing them over the top of Tag's posters as a witty retort, allowing fans to, in essence, see both shows at once.

These days, all my promo is digital (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Mad-Geniu ... 9996210153) and Tag is following me.

I win!

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby defactobrigade » Wed Jul 14, 2010 11:58 am

I talked to someone from the Majestic who said they no longer work there anymore - He didn't want to be quoted...so yeah I'll paraphrase. He said that they will rip down any flyers that are covering up their flyers, much in the same way Tag will (or so this person claims Tag will - I'm not accusing anyone of anything) - He then proceeded to give me the chat that I should consider NOT ripping down their flyers so that I wouldn't blacklist myself from ever playing one of their precious shows (also mentioned that they book at other venues so I need to be careful!!).

As if everyone in the whole goddamn music scene cares about getting on promoter shows...

yuck.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby benfury » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:04 pm

the bands we open for play at the frequency and sometimes at the high noon. none of them could fill the majestic except ben weasel, and he already hates me for unrelated reasons. im not too concerned.

i like the idea of making kiosk extensions. im gonna do that.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby defactobrigade » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:30 pm

benfury wrote:the bands we open for play at the frequency and sometimes at the high noon. none of them could fill the majestic except ben weasel, and he already hates me for unrelated reasons. im not too concerned.

i like the idea of making kiosk extensions. im gonna do that.


Yeah I know Ben! I'm on YR side. I totally agree. I don't play shows that could fill the majestic either - and probably wouldn't want to unless some amazing band that will never play madison anyways comes through (hope you didn't think I was belittling you or something).

The Kiosk Extensions idea is GOLD. Next time I flyer I'm doing that too. I like the dude's story about Tag too (bewildered look on his face...hehe).
-b

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby swoon_queen » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:35 pm

defactobrigade wrote: He then proceeded to give me the chat that I should consider NOT ripping down their flyers so that I wouldn't blacklist myself from ever playing one of their precious shows (also mentioned that they book at other venues so I need to be careful!!).

As if everyone in the whole goddamn music scene cares about getting on promoter shows...

yuck.


Good point; also, I'd add that a really good band is a really good band, and regardless of their promotional efforts/etiquette if they are talented and/or have a decent draw they won't be blacklisted in a city the size of Madison. Some local groups have concentrated their efforts enough that they can headline & pack the HNS, and those bands don't need to open for a large touring act at the Majestic-- the Majestic needs them to get their fan base in the door.

Independent entities-- promoters, musicians, venues--without a huge promotional budget can't afford to spend money on big print ad campaigns or radio promo, but when they make the effort and the budget to create flyers it's really tiresome that their flyers get ripped down for the sake of shows that are heavily trumpeted in the pages of every publication in town. There are folks who innocently put up a flyer, even taking care to avoid covering over shows that haven't happened yet, without knowing the unspoken rules of the kiosks (Tag "gets" the top two tiers, etc.)and they get ripped down indiscriminately. Any promoter or venue who pays lip service to "supporting the local scene"-- or uses local bands to draw in fans for touring acts who haven't yet developed a following here-- yet will rip down local flyers that aren't directly plastered over their own is hypocritical.

The part about this that really sucks is that it breeds discontent and disconnection in the Madison music scene as a whole.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby Exploding Pinto » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:42 pm

Mad Genius, you mention checking into the rules for using the kiosks. What are the rules for using them?

A couple sorta on topic and older Isthmus articles on State Street kiosks:
http://www.isthmus.com/daily/article.php?article=4465

http://www.thedailypage.com/isthmus/article.php?article=4781

and one from the AV club last summer:

http://www.avclub.com/madison/articles/flyering-madison-tradition-or-almost-pointless,30808/

Last year Scott of the Majestic told the AV club the flyering situation was lovey dovey:

"I think all the respect venues and promoters show each other with regard to flyering might be the most respectful thing they do with each other in all their interactions."

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby green union terrace chair » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:45 pm

swoon_queen wrote:... the unspoken rules of the kiosks (Tag "gets" the top two tiers, etc.) ...


Does he seriously think he's entitled to this? They're public property, for crying out loud.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby DjFoundation » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:56 pm

Wow, I wish I would have seen this sooner, I just emailed Majestic this morning. I got an immediate response and, based on that and knowing them, I don't believe they'd issue specific orders to rip down whatever doesn't have their name on it. I think people just get carried away and they're well aware of the current discontent. You know what they say about finding good help these days.

I've been hanging fliers/posters for shows for many years, and I always wonder why I'm doing it the entire time -but I still do it, and I still avoid the top couple rows. I, too, agree that it's better to have Tag and Majestic on the top, since they are the ones bringing in the most diversity and consistency. It just sucks having to deal with a 2% return on something I designed by hand, printed out of pocket, and walked 10 miles taping up around town at knee-level only to see it ripped in half a few hours later. Then again, they say you've got to suffer for your art, right?


oh, by the way, here's a flier.
Image

:wink:

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby defactobrigade » Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:58 pm

green union terrace chair wrote:
swoon_queen wrote:... the unspoken rules of the kiosks (Tag "gets" the top two tiers, etc.) ...


Does he seriously think he's entitled to this? They're public property, for crying out loud.

He doesn't think this. He KNOWS this. It's just a SAD fact about Madison.

That goes back to the "if you want to get on his shows, don't fuck with his shit" mentality that I personally hate. I don't really flyer anymore, but if I did, I'd respect it out of the fact that he's out there every day flyering and he's just going to rip down yr shit if it's on the top tier anyways.
Majestic is a different story - relatively new entity in terms of flyering (since becoming a "snooze" errrrr. "ROCK" club), and they should have NO reason to think they own a piece of the kiosk.
Tag doesn't really own it, he just has the resources to take yr flyers down if you cover them up, whereas most bands don't have the time/energy to keep up with that.

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Re: the majestic pays people to rip down competing fliers

Postby supaunknown » Wed Jul 14, 2010 2:34 pm

defactobrigade wrote:
green union terrace chair wrote:
swoon_queen wrote:... the unspoken rules of the kiosks (Tag "gets" the top two tiers, etc.) ...

Does he seriously think he's entitled to this? They're public property, for crying out loud.

He doesn't think this. He KNOWS this. It's just a SAD fact about Madison.

That goes back to the "if you want to get on his shows, don't fuck with his shit" mentality that I personally hate. I don't really flyer anymore, but if I did, I'd respect it out of the fact that he's out there every day flyering and he's just going to rip down yr shit if it's on the top tier anyways.
Majestic is a different story - relatively new entity in terms of flyering (since becoming a "snooze" errrrr. "ROCK" club), and they should have NO reason to think they own a piece of the kiosk.
Tag doesn't really own it, he just has the resources to take yr flyers down if you cover them up, whereas most bands don't have the time/energy to keep up with that.

Countless uninitiated posterers have tried to uproot him on those top two kiosk rows. All have failed. Tag's got pathological resolve in spades.
There's a certain je ne sais quoi to posters that doesn't carry over to the digital world. A scrapbook full of tactile old posters seems far more romantic than a disc containing bytey bunches of JPEGs.


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